Axis planes lost during Market Garden?

Discussion in 'Axis Units' started by Ramiles, Jan 3, 2018.

  1. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    I was glancing at this page: Defending Arnhem © 2006

    To quote from which: "During the period 17th – 26th September 1944, the Luftwaffe employed up to 10 different Jagdgeschwaders that flew from airfields such as Dortmund, Werl, Paderborn, Guetersloh, Stoermede, Achmer, Lippspringe and Plantluenne. They were to score a total of 122 victories over this period with more than half of them coming from JG 11 and JG 26 combined. These victories are listed below by date and by pilot."

    I couldn't however see a simple way to see similar details reported on German Luftwaffe losses over the same period.

    I've tried a few google searches and browsed the "Defending Arnhem" site a bit further - so far without success, I wonder if anyone happens to know of any similar sources for these? i.e. any details of German planes lost or shot down (by various means) during the period 17th – 26th September 1944 in this area.

    Defending Arnhem © 2006

    Including: "Even though the Allies had air supremacy, they did not underestimate the potential of havoc the Luftwaffe could still cause in the West in the later months of 1944. Most missions over German occupied territories still came with a powerful fighter escort for this specific reason. Some of the allied fighters were “long range” and could now provide protection for greater periods of time. For the planning of Operation ‘Market Garden', it was to be no different. All allied transports into the Arnhem area were to have fighter escorts (sic) were possible.

    The German Luftwaffe still possessed some advantages over the allies in September 1944. From within the ‘Fortress' cities that they still controlled on the Coast of France as well as the occupied areas of Northwest Holland, the Germans could inform the Luftwaffe headquarters of impending allied formations flying East towards Germany. Based on this information, the Luftwaffe were able to scramble fighters to intercept the RAF and USAAF planes before reaching their objectives. This was exactly what occurred on the initial landings on the 17th September 1944. However, due to the effective allied fighter escort on the first day, the transport planes carrying the British Paratroops into Arnhem were not harassed by the Luftwaffe.

    Ps... The page: Operational history of the Luftwaffe (1939–45) - Wikipedia

    Has (currently:Jan 2018): "During Operation Market Garden, the Allied attempt to end the war in 1944 by forcing a route through the Netherlands and into the Ruhr region of Germany, Luftwaffe fighter forces managed to inflict significant losses on Allied planes transporting paratroopers and supplies into battle, but their own losses were serious. The Jagddivision's operational in the area claimed 209 Allied aircraft destroyed, including only 35 transport aircraft. In return the Luftwaffe lost 192 fighters.[103] The Allied operation failed, and the Luftwaffe survived into the following year."

    Ref: " Caldwell & Putz 2007, p. 236" - Caldwell, Donald; Muller, Richard (2007), The Luftwaffe over Germany: Defense of the Reich, London: Greenhill Books
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2018
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  2. horsapassenger

    horsapassenger Senior Member

    Air Support during Market Garden was a complicated issue as will be seen from the attached. During the re supply missions, when most of the losses occurred, Air Support was suspended for up to 4 hours at a time and the Luftwaffe was quick to seize upon the opportunities offered to attack the, sometimes unarmed, and totally unprotected supply aircraft

    Attached Files:

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  3. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    I have recently transcribed this from a letter dated - 22nd September 1944:

    7880500 Sgt.B.Symes
    Sherwood Rangers

    "Yesterday some of Jerries planes poked their noses out, one came over awkward like, and turned over and the pilot seemed to drop out and his parachute opened nicely, the plane crashed and the pilot was in the bag. A few mins later there was a scatter and out of the blue raced two planes, both diving low, just as they reached us there was a terrific burst of firing and the front plane’s tail flew off and down he came complete with his jockey, it was a Boche. They don’t like our Ack Ack guns either, they come so far, up goes the stuff and the Boche turns tail for home.

    The prettiest sight I’ve seen since the war started was when the planes dropped supplies to the Yanks, the parachutes are yellow, white, blue, green and red and there were hundreds floating down. It isn’t wise to stand around as some of the strings break and though one welcomes a box of rations at any time, when they hurtle down at a few hundred miles an hour its unhealthy to be too close, they hit the deck and bounce about twenty yards. Even so it’s good to watch. I haven’t seen the men dropped yet, just missed that.

    We picked up some of the chutes, they were no use so the Yanks told me, but there were some nice bits of Rayon, everyone now has a scarf."

    This is the matching bit from the war diary of the Sherwood Rangers:

    21st September 1944

    A Sqn with D Sqn ROYALS are to be responsible for the SE sector from WYLER in the North to MOOR in the SOUTH.

    B Sqn with our own Recce Tp are to be responsible for the North from WYLER up to NIJMEGEN. ??? 2 Tp of B Sqn and one tp of Recce were sent North to a place called OOIJ without contacting much opposition.

    Capt McKay and his Recce Tp crossed the German frontier and claim to be the first British troops to do so. A Sqn lost one tank South of MOOK. Recce tp captured a prisoner who had been a Naval Cadet.

    22nd September 1944

    A Sqn remained in same area, with Sqn of Royals. C Sqn took over from B Sqn in the Northern Sector.

    C Sqn led an attack with No3 U.S. Airborne Bn to clear an area NE of NIJMEGEN and south of the RIVER. Our line of communications between here and EINDHOVEN has been cut and the Coldstream Guards (Armoured) with Inf sp. Have been sent back to clear up the situation.

    C Sqns attack was successful and they spent the night in BEEK.

    From another letter my grandfather (Sgt.B.Symes SRY) wrote:

    "Sunday 24th September. The post Corporal tells me that there is no letters going back yet, as my last letter is still here.

    This morning we were sat around a small fire when two planes flew over fairly low, I mentioned that they looked like Jerries, although lots of ours had been around they were Jerries too and before they were out of sight fifty two other planes came over, again they were Jerries, there was a big scatter and up went the A.A. they were soon away with some of ours mixed up with them.

    Here’s the I.O.C. news coming up. We get the A.E.F. programme.

    They said there was heavy bombing in the Dusseldorf area, we heard ‘em pounding over.

    Wednesday 27th There were letters this morning, I had one from Sid Weller, no news in it.

    So the letters must be going out too so I’ll pop this in pronto. By the way I have misplaced that picture of Rob, I put it back into the envelope and although I have quite a number of your letters I just can’t find that one, if you have another print will you send it on, I’m annoyed about that.

    I hope you are going along well my dear. Keep your fingers crossed and hope for a daughter won’t you. I bet you’ll cuss if it’s a boy!

    All my love to you both from your loving husband Bex. Xxx.

    And the matching dates from around that time in the Sherwood Rangers War Diary:

    23rd September 1944:

    B Sqn relieved A Sqn in the MOOK area.

    C Sqn continued to sp the Inf North of BEEK. 2 tanks were knocked out.

    24th September 1944:

    C Sqn still operated with No3 U.S. Bn. One tank was knocked out in enemy lines.

    25th September 1944

    A Sqn operating in the North experienced considerable enemy shelling. H.H. Heenan was killed.

    C Sqn took over from B Sqn in the South.

    The supply road was again cut.

    Frank Guilard of the B.B.C. visited the Regiment.

    26th September 1944

    B Sqn operated in North and C Sqn in the South.

    2 Tps of C Sqn were called upon to rescue some Americans who had been cut off in OENDEUVEL Wood.

    They had one tank brewed up and one damaged.

    27th September 1944

    A Sqn had to sp an attack in the MOOK area. They had very stiff fighting but no causalities.

    28th September 1944

    C Sqn in the early morning were counter-attacked by enemy Infantry and tanks. They knocked out four tanks. A Sqn operated in the South, and in the evening, on being relieved by B Sqn they joined RHQ.

    29th September 1944

    Quietest time for some considerable time. B sqn in the South, C Sqn in the North. A Sqn relieved C Sqn in the evening.

    The NIJMAGEN bridge was destroyed by 12 Germans who had swum down the river for approximately 8 miles in special swimming equipment. These Germans had been recalled from FLORENCE where they had been for special training. All 12 were eventually captured. A pontoon bridge has been put across the river which will be used until the other is restored.

    Last edited: Apr 4, 2019
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