Willie Imrie Scottish footballer died serving in RAF

Discussion in 'Searching for Someone & Military Genealogy' started by Owen, Sep 26, 2015.

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  1. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Willie Imrie was a Scottish footballer who also played for Swindon Town a couple of times.
    He died aged 36 in 1944 whilst serving in the RAF .
    Neither I nor Diane can find him on CWGC.
    Has he been left off the CWGC lists ?


    Here's a few links we found.

    http://www.perthstjohnstonefc.co.uk/history-legends.php#wimrie


    http://www.swindonweb.com/?m=8&s=116&ss=346&c=5603&t=D-Day+Hero

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willie_Imrie

    http://www.thisiswiltshire.co.uk/news/11643233.VIDEO__Plaque_commemorates_Swindon_Town_s_wartime_players/
     
    Owen, Sep 26, 2015
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  2. DaveB

    DaveB Very Senior Member

    I can't find a suitable match in the flight global archive of RAF casualty lists.

    I would say that the Coldstream Guards reference is a straight up typo in the newspaper as the next name on the list was also a member of that unit.


    I think I have seen cases of RAAF personnel who were discharged during the war due to incurable diseases (TB for example) who then were not considered to be war dead as they died following their service (even though it was still during the eligibility period). Presuming someone could track down his service details and death certificate there should be valid grounds to get his death listed by the CWGC.

    I just checked the RAF OR cards to find his service number - William Noble Imrie had service number 1674119 - not too sure where that leads us, but it proves he was in the RAF
     

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    DaveB, Sep 26, 2015
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  3. amberdog45

    amberdog45 Senior Member

    Could this be him?
     

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    amberdog45, Sep 26, 2015
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  4. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    No.


    the one you found died in 1942 on active service not in 44 of an illness.
    crew from that article all listed.

    http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2101979/IMRIE,%20WILLIAM

    http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2079784/BIGGANE,%20DENZIL%20FRANCIS%20HERIZ

    http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2080096/COOK,%20RICHARD

    http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2102835/PONT,%20HENRY%20CLIFFORD

    http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2102905/READ,%20KENNETH%20NEVILLE
     
    Owen, Sep 26, 2015
    #4
  5. amberdog45

    amberdog45 Senior Member

    Here he is.
     

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    amberdog45, Sep 26, 2015
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  6. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Dave re the death of an RAF chap I have posted here ( you added a lot of info) http://ww2talk.com/forums/topic/42009-godwin-monck-casualty-61240/ and i have death cert which states died due to war operations although RAF says he was discharged and CWGC will not accept it.

    might be worth contacting

    AIR HISTORICAL BRANCH ((RAF)
    Building 824
    RAF Northolt
    West End Road
    Ruislip
    Middlesex
    HA4 6NG
     
    CL1, Sep 26, 2015
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  7. dbf

    dbf Moderatrix MOD

    From Ancestry, index of Perth newspaper, January 1945:
    Not proof of him actually being in service at the time of his death, but it gives a further reference to RAF.
    Screen Shot 2015-09-26 at 01.19.47.png
     
    dbf, Sep 26, 2015
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  8. amberdog45

    amberdog45 Senior Member

    Found this at findagrave, but I think there's something odd. States he was buried the same date he died. I don't buy that at all. I'm hoping to go down to Fife for a bit of research through the council archives hopefully in November. I'll see how far away the cemetery is from the archive centre and try and make a visit.

    Edit: I've emailed the monumental inscription service via Fife Council to see if you they can provide the layout plan and plot number.
     

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    amberdog45, Sep 26, 2015
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  9. amberdog45

    amberdog45 Senior Member

    Here's the article from the 2nd Jan
     

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    amberdog45, Sep 26, 2015
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  10. Mr Jinks

    Mr Jinks Bit of a Cad

    There was a similar case on here regarding a DLI soldier(found by Ramacal) Pte GH Carrad who was featured on a CWGC Memorial Screen Wall, Panel 1 at Lambeth Cemetery. but not on their Debt of Honour Roll. Chris Charley looked into it and although his death certificate still referred to him by number /regiment and Rank it was discovered he had been discharged a week or so before his death and buried in a communal grave. The CWGC were happy to add him on their memorial but NOT their online register. He died of Lung Cancer, perhaps similar circumstances?


    Kyle
     

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    Mr Jinks, Sep 26, 2015
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  11. dbf

    dbf Moderatrix MOD

    Details of his 2 international appearances for Scotland, both in 1929.
    http://www.rsssf.com/tabless/scot-intres1930.html

    (Match 144) 26th May 1929 (Friendly match)

    NORWAY - SCOTLAND 3-7 (2-3)

    Referee: Fredrik Schieldrop (Norway)
    
Crowd: 4.000, Brann Stadion, Bergen

    Goals: 1-0 Kongsvik (4), 1-1 Rankin (6), 1-2 T.Craig (27), 1-3 Cheyne (30), 2-3 Berg-Johannesen (37),
2-4 Nisbet (47), 2-5 Nisbet (52), 2-6 Cheyne (64), 2-7 Cheyne (68), 3-7 Kongsvik (76)


    NORWAY:

    Hugo Hofstad -
    Haakon Walde, Egil Brenna Lund -
    Tollef Ravn Tollefsen, Alexander Olsen, Kjeld Kjos -

    Kaare Kongsvik, Oscar Thorstensen, Rolf Brodahl, Kaare Lie, Sverre Berg-Johannesen.



    SCOTLAND:

    Alexander (Sandy) McLaren (1/St Johnstone) -

    James Sermagour Crapnell (2/Airdrieonians)
Joseph Nibloe (2/Kilmarnock) -

    William Noble Imrie (1/St Johnstone)
 Allan Craig (1/Motherwell)
Thomas Craig [c] (3/Rangers) -

    James Nisbet (1/Ayr United)
Alexander George Cheyne (2/Aberdeen)
David McCrae (1/St Mirren)
Robert Rankin (1/St Mirren)
Robert Howe (1/Hamilton Academical)


    Notes: This was an unofficial match for Norway.
Sandy McLaren was the youngest goalkeeper to play for Scotland - at 18 years & 152 days old.



    [hr]



    (Match 145) 1st June 1929 (Friendly match)
    
GERMANY - SCOTLAND 1-1 (0-0)

    Referee: Otto Ohlsson (Sweden)

    Crowd: 40.000, Grunewaldstadion, Berlin

    Goals: 1-0 Ruch (49), 1-1 Imrie (87)

    GERMANY:
    (Coach: Dr.Otto Nerz)

    Heinrich Stuhlfauth [c] -
    Franz Schutz, Hans Brunke -
    Hans Geiger, Hans Gruber, Conrad Heidkamp -
Hans Ruch, Johannes Sobeck, Josef Pottinger, Richard Hofmann, Ludwig Hofmann.



    SCOTLAND:

    Alexander (Sandy) McLaren (2/St Johnstone) -

    Douglas Herbert Gray (3/Rangers)
James Sermagour Crapnell (3/Airdrieonians) -

    Hugh Auld Morton (1/Kilmarnock)
 William Noble Imrie (2/St Johnstone)
 Thomas Craig [c] (4/Rangers) -

    James Nisbet (2/Ayr United)
Alexander George Cheyne (3/Aberdeen)
David McCrae (2/St Mirren)
Robert Rankin (2/St Mirren)
James William Fleming (1/Rangers)


    GERMANY:
    (Coach: Dr.Otto Nerz)

    Heinrich Stuhlfauth [c] -
    Franz Schutz, Hans Brunke -
    Hans Geiger, Hans Gruber, Conrad Heidkamp -

    Hans Ruch, Johannes Sobeck, Josef Pottinger, Richard Hofmann, Ludwig Hofmann.

    [hr]

    From this link:
    http://www.fussballdaten.de/vereine/deutschland/1929/
    which gives the German squad for 1929
    Trainer / Nationality / DOB
    Otto Nerz / German / 21.10.1892

    http://www.fussballdaten.de/spieler/nerzotto/1936/
    same DOB but with DOD given as 19.04.1949
    as per wiki page, which states he survived war but died in a POW camp.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Nerz



    From http://www.volksbund.de/, the only one of the German 1929 squad with a match is the coach:
    Otto Nerz ruht auf der Kriegsgräberstätte in Seeburg b. Potsdam-Dorfstraße.
    Endgrablage: Kameradengrab
    Surname: Nerz
    First name: Otto
    Rank: Volkssturmmann
    DOB : 21.10.1892
    Date of Death / Declared missing: 04.1945

    although the site has give his date of death as 1949, all else matches, s
     
    dbf, Sep 26, 2015
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