LCP 212 from the Dieppe Raid found in archival film

Hi everyone,

While doing research for my Fusiliers Mont-Royal at Dieppe project, I've found the LCT 212 in an archival film!

On my side, it's the first time I see it, as it doesn't seem to appear in most of the the aftermath pictures/films of the Raid, so I though I should share it here.

From my research:

LCP 212 was commanded by Lt. R. A. Durham of the R.N.V.R.

It was part of the Forth Flotilla, Group 7 (Floating Reserve) and was used by the Fusiliers Mont-Royal. One of the two LCPs lost during the Raid.

I've manage to extract a picture from the film, hard to see where it is laying, but it seems that his rear is facing the beach front, and I think the black line at the top might be the pier, so I would place it near the Casino, but it's just a speculation.

 

I wouldn't read too much into the final location of the landing craft, the tide was running up the Channel from the SW to the NE, so it could have drifted onto its final position on the beach.

The Dieppe roll identifies three of the LCP's four crew.

Lt R.A. Durham - Killed
AB J.M. Chambers - Returned
OS Brennan - Returned

I've not been able to identify the mechanic. From the casualty lists of the 4th LCP Flotilla, I've still got missing 3 OR who I've yet to identify, so it's possible he is a Sto/MM who is listed as a POW, but who I've yet to assign a landing craft.

Regards,

Steve

 

Yeah, was highly speculative.

Thanks for the info on the Crew, would you happen to have more information about who in the FMR was in it?

On my side, I could place some of the FMR together, but never with the LCP number. I was able to place some that were in LCT, I think those archive might be more complete.

 

No unfortunately I've never been able to find any surviving loading plans for this or the other LCP's. From survivors reports I can place a handful of soldiers on some LCP's, but even then they're identified by a 'R' number (a number assigned for loading admin), rather than the actual landing craft number.

Regards,

Steve

 

Oh that's what those are. I also found some "R" numbers and was wondering what those were... As if it wasn't already a rare info.

Records seems to exist for the LCTs, I found one at least, but the Canadiana archives are something to look into.

 

Yes I've got correlation between the LCT number and the Dieppe numbers (1- 24), but I've never been able to find a similar list for the Group 7 LCP's other than the below information.

LCP's R1-R5 - A Company
LCP's R6-R10 - D Company
[LCP163 (R6), LCP152/LCP45 (R9)] (LCP152 aborted with engine trouble and was replaced as 'R9' by LCP45)
LCP's R11-R15 - Btn HQ and HQ Coy
[LCP47 (R14), LCP166 (possibly R15)]
LCP's R16-R20 - B Company
[LCP186 (R16), LCP167 (possibly R19)]
LCP's R21-R25 - C Company

As noted, I've managed to identify a few, but most are unknown to me (including 'R23' which is recorded as being wrecked during the landing). So if you've got any soldiers reports referring to 'R' numbers I'd be interested to see if I could use them to identify which LCP's they were on.

Regards,

Steve

 

LIeut Masson was in R24, which confirm your information that R21 to R25 was C company.

R23 was to his left, so it could be another one from C.

Also from what I've gather, which isn't confirmed, all LCP landed in a single line in that order from left to right :

B Coy - HQ Coy - C Coy - A Coy - D Coy

I'va managed to place in the same LCP

Cpt Vandelac and Lt Trudel

Cpt Dumais and L/Cpl Taylor

Sgt Chabot, Cpt Camaraire, Cpt Dilion

As for the LCT, I have the name for all the guys in LCT 2 - No 127 and four name in Lct 3- No 159

 

Cheers,

Yes from what I've been able to uncover, the landing looked something like this.

Seafront
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

▲ ▲ ▲ ▲ ▲

B Coy Btn HQ/HQ Coy C Coy A Coy D Coy

The planned order of landing, from east to west appears to have been:

▲ ▲

4th Flotilla 5th Flotilla


R20,19,18,17,16(FO),15,14,13,12,11 R10,9,8,7,6(FO),5,4,3,2,1

R21,22,23,24,25,

(The C Coy group appear to have followed behind in line astern and landed just after the rest of the Btn)

I'd be interested in seeing the names of the Fusiliers you have placed onboard the LCT's.

I've only been able to place a few of the soldiers.

Lt Col Dollard Menard (Possibly LCP R11) [According to the loading plan he should have been in an LCP with Adjt Capt Camarine]
Capt Robert H. Lejoie (Possibly LCT121 (2))
H/Capt J.A. Sabourin (LCP R14)
Lt Pierre Benoit (Possibly LCT121 (2))
Lt Antoine A. Masson (LCP R24)
Lt Joseph G.Y. Tetreault (LCT159 (3))
A/Cpl Marcel Jolicoeur (LCT...) [He list noted in a book as being on LCT'5', but that is incorrect as no FMR were on that LCT]
Pte D. Bonneau (LCT159(3))
Pte S. Dorais (LCT159 (3))
Pte Fernand Labrecque (LCT159 (3))
Pte C. Ricard (LCP R10)
Pte (or Sgt) G. St Onge (LCT127 (2))

Regards,

Steve

 

Here's what I had so far. for the LCT 2 - No 127 I only had the last name so there's a bit of guess work for some. Most of not all returned to England.

LCT 3 - No 159
Lt Y. Tétreault
Cpl M. Jolicoeur
PTE G. Varin
PTE A. Edmond

LCT 2 - No 127 Mk. II
Lt. P. Benoit
Pte A. Brisebois
Cpt R. H. Lajoie
Sgt P.G. Dubé
Cpl V. Desjardins
Cpl V. Marticotte
Cpl E. Lapointe
L/pl G. ou O. Mathieu
Pte G. Bernard
Pte P. Mercier
Pte G. Tremblay
Pte J. Dufresne
Pte A. ou L.L. Bouchard
Pte L. Mondoux
Pte A. ou R. Martin
Pte Maurice Tousignant
Pte A. Cinq-Mars
Pte J.B. Dussault
Pte A. Daoust
Pte A. Bélanger
Pte L. Drouin
Pte M. Pierre
Pte A. ou G. Morin
Pte Wilfred Nolet
Pte D. Monchamp
Pte G. St-Onge
Pte C. Blais
Pte C. ou G. Rochon
Pte G. ou J. Henault
Pte R. Martineau
Pte C. Ouimet
Pte R. Crevier
Pte J. Paquette

 

Thanks for that.

Regarding the LCT127(2) personnel, I have Pte's Tousignant and Tremblay listed as POW's, but was of the understanding that none of the FMR personnel landed from this LCT. So its seems I was in error and that a few of the Fusiliers were able to reach the beach despite the heavy shore fire.

Regards

Steve

 

Tousignant is confirmed in the War Diary of the Regiment as returned.

As for G. Tremblay, seven ''Tremblay'' were presents at the Raid with the FMR, so it's hard to identify really which one was the one, but G. Tremblay is the only one confirmed as Returned, so since all abord that LCT returned, I make the assomption that he was the one that LCT, but it's a speculation.

 

hi Steve,
re LCT121 no.5 - definitely not carrying FMR. I have a comprehensive list of most of the Royal Hamilton Light Infantry Platoon and Beach Party members transported on LCT121, including Lt TINSLEY, 8 Platoon, A Coy, RHLI, (KIA), Capt SKERRETT (KIA) and Lt COUNSELL (wounded returned).
LCT127 no.2 carried an FMR Platoon which included Capt. LAJOIE; Lt. BENOIT - all appear to have remained on board and were returned to England, although some were wounded while LCT127 spent over 40 mins on and near shore making two attempts to unloaded its cargo of tanks and taking over twenty direct hits from mortar and artillery in the process.
The other reserve FMR Platoon was aboard LCT159 no.3, and included Capt VANDELAC, Lieut TETRAULT, and CSM HOGUE (KIA). All landed and they suffered heavy casualties.
Cheers
Phil

 

Hi Phil,

Cheers for that. Yes I've got to loading tables for the LCT's. At least three of the FMR soldiers on LCT127(2) were wounded on the LCT during the failed landing attempt.

On a different subject, did you ever manage to dig out the crew lists for LCT125(8), LCT166(9) and LCT165(10)?

Regards,

Steve

 

Hi Steve, bear in mind the 16th August Allotment tables are not 100% correct. There were some last minute changes.
I have most of the crews for the 2nd Flight LCTs. A couple of gaps - especially re the 'extras' - SBAs, gunners, etc. Just checking a few out at the moment.
Cheers
Phil

 

Hi Phil,

I've sent you an email with the various RN casualties I'm still looking to identify. Any updates/corrections gratefully received.

Regards

Steve

 

I didn't have Lajoie and Lt Benoit on that one, glad to add some names. Do you remember where that info came from?

Thanks

 

Hi,

It's possible to place Capt Lajoie and Lt Benoit onboard LCT127(2) from the description of their actions in their medal citations (in TNA document DEFE2/327).

Regards,

Steve

 

Thanks!

I'm actually working on the embarcation placement as of right now. While it's easy to place them on LCT vs LCP, still hard to find which one.

I've found out recently that Lucien Desjardins was on a LCT and possibly the same as CPT Alleyn.

 

Do you have the doc, from the TNA it's not scanned yet. About to order it, but if you have if.

 

No I'm afraid I don't have a copy of the document, I've only got handwritten notes that I made whilst going through it.

Regards,

Steve