2bn South Lancashire Regiment

Discussion in 'Burma & India' started by chris-s, Oct 19, 2012.

  1. chris-s

    chris-s Junior Member

    I an trying to trace any information relating to my father, whom I believe was the RSM of the 2nd Battalion South lancashire Regiment,

    The only information I have is that he joined the army (as a boy entrant?) in about 1919/1920 and was discharged in 1949/1950 after service in india in the 1930s & Burma during the war against Japan

    His name was Frederick Sinnett & he was born in 1906 in Widnes, & he died in 1970 in Southport,

    All information will be gratefully received, thank you

    Chris Sinnett.
  2. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Welcome to the forum.
    Have you sent off for his service records from the MoD yet?
    I'd also suggest getitng their war diaries at Kew copied by someone or visit there yourself .

    WO 166/4678 INFANTRY: 2 South Lancashire Regiment (Prince of Wales's Volunteers). 1940 May - 1941 Dec.
    WO 166/8972 2 South Lancashire Regiment (Prince of Wales's Volunteers) 1942 Jan., Feb.
    WO 172/2528 2 South Lancashire Regiment (Prince of Wales's Volunteers) 1943 Jan.- Dec.
    WO 172/4897 2 South Lancashire Regiment (Prince of Wales's Volunteers) 1944 Jan.- Dec.
    WO 172/7648 2 South Lancashire Regiment (Prince of Wales's Volunteers) 1945 Jan.-Dec.
    WO 174/31 2 South Lancashire Regiment (Prince of Wales's Volunteers) 1942 Mar-Dec
  3. Mike L

    Mike L Very Senior Member

    Hi Chris and welcome.
    Funnily enough I was in the process of sending an email to a member here, Pete Keane, who has looked into the South Lancs in some depth when I saw your thread. I gave him a link to this thread but you could try sending him a Private Message if he does not post here soon.
  4. dryan67

    dryan67 Senior Member

    Here is a summary of the service of the 2nd South Lancashire Regiment during the war in the meantime:

    2nd Battalion, The South Lancashire Regiment (The Prince of Wales’s Volunteers)

    Bombay District – 3 September 1940 to January 1940
    The battalion was deployed at Bombay manning the fortress and on internal security duties in Bombay.

    Bareilly Area – Meerut District – January 1940 to 5 June 1940
    It moved to Bareilly in January 1940 from Bombay and remained there until early June 1940. It then returned to Bombay and embarked on June 5th, 1940 for England.

    WO Control – 5 June 1940 to 17 July 1940
    The 2nd South Lancs arrived at Liverpool on July 17th, 1940.

    29th Independent Infantry Brigade Group – 18 July 1940 to 16 April 1944
    On arrival it moved to Sussex and joined the brigade on July 18th, 1940. It moved to Inverary in April 1941 for amphibious training and later to Galashiels, where it received orders for overseas. It was located in the United Kingdom until March 20th, 1942 and embarked on March 21st, 1942.
    The battalion remained at sea until April 22nd, 1942, when it arrived in South Africa. It remained there briefly until April 28th, 1942. It then embarked for Madagascar, arriving on May 5th, 1942 for an attack on Antisrane. It served in Madagascar until August 20th, 1942 and moved by sea to East Africa. It arrived on August 26th, 1942 and remained in East Africa until September 5th, 1942. It left by sea and arrived at Deigo Suarez, Madagascar on September 9th to prepare for an assault at Majunga on the 10th. It landed at Tamatave on the 18th and moved to Antananarivo on the 24th. It left Antananarivo on October 15th and arrived at Tamatave the next day, where it embarked for South Africa on the 16th. It arrived by sea at Durban, South Africaon October 24th, 1942. On arrival in South Africa it moved to Hay Paddock Camp, Pietermaritzburg and to Classword Camp, Durban in December 1942. It left Durban, South Africa on January 8th, 1943. It was at sea until January 28th, 1943, when it arrived in Bombay. It moved to Poona on arrival. In March 1943 it moved to Mahableshwar for jungle training and returned to Poona in April. Sometime between April and June 1943, it moved to the Saugor area and then returned back to Poona in early June 1943. The first echelons arrived in Calcutta on February 9th and the battalion arrived at Chittagong on February 10th, 1944. On March 7th it was located on Mayu Ridge and was withdrawn into brigade reserve on April 3rd. The battalion left Burma on 16 April 1944

    114th Indian Infantry Brigade – 27 April 1944 to 11 July 1945
    The battalion left Burma on April 16th, 1944 and joined the 114th Indian Infantry Brigade at Bawli Bazaar on April 27th, 1944. It moved to Dimapur on May 9th and arrived at Kohima on May 20th. On June 1st it was located at Church Knoll, Kohima and was fighting towards Kidema village on the 7th. It reached the Kidema Village area on June 14th and returned to Kohima on the 28th, where it remained until early December 1944. On December 7th, it left Imphal and began to move down the Tamu Road into the Kabaw Valley. On the 18th, it was ordered to an area six miles south of Tamu. By the 25th, it reached the Tamu area. It was at Gangaw on January 20th, 1945 then moved to Mawle and Tilin. It reached Myitche on February 7th and Beywathit on the 10th. By February 13th, it had concentrated at a crossing point on the Irrawaddy River opposte Nyangu and crossed the following day. On the 19th, it went into brigade reserve southeast of Nyangu. It was operating south of Nyangu in the Mount Popa area on February 23rd. On March 20th it was enroute to Letse and two days later it was in the Letse Box. It moved to Yawathit on April 8th and reached there on the 11th. On the 19th, it advanced to MS 8 on the Gewbin-Seikpu road and reached Salin the next day. It remained there until April 27th. In early May it was at Pyinbu then Minbu while at the end of May it was at Magwe. The 2nd South Lancs were detached to the 33rd Indian Infantry Brigade for a brief period from February 13th to 15th, 1945 (February 7th to 23th?) during the Irrawaddy Crossing. It was also detached to the 28th East African Brigade for a period from March 15th to April 2nd for operations at Point 534 west of the Irrawaddy. On June 5th, the battalion was at Zigon.

    South Burma District – 11 July to 29 July 1945
    The battalion left the brigade on July 11th, 1945 at Zigon and and served under the South Burma District until July 29th, 1945. On July 29th, it embarked at Rangoon for India.

    268th Indian Infantry Brigade – 6 August 1945 to 19 August 1945
    The battalion returned to India and served under the 268th Indian Infantry Brigade at Ranchi.

    23rd Infantry Brigade – 19 August 1945 to 31 August 1945
    It served under the brigade in Ranchi.
  5. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Hi Chris and welcome to the forum-click the red link below if you require any of the Bn diaries. I have four of them already. ;)
  6. Pete Keane

    Pete Keane Senior Member

    Hi Chris,

    The war diaries will give you the Battalions movements for the war years.

    As RSM I would expect your father to be in the HQ Company.

    It is likely that he is mentioned in other documents, the Regiment published a magazine up to 1938, I will look through the later copy I have and see what mentions there are.

    If he served in the 2nd Battalion for his career, then he would have been out to Afghanistan (as now known) in the early 20's.

    I recall a post here from another member who posted lots of S.Lancs photos from that period, I will see if I can find the thread.

    You should have a range of medals from his service? These will have his service numbers around the edge, he will have had 2 service numbers, as the system changed whilst he was serving.

    Photo's - do you have any of him in uniform.

    Photo's - as he was RSM it is possible that the Museum in Preston may have Regimental photos with him in them.

    There are books - the Regimantal history is available on the internet, expect to pay about £60 or so.

    Louis Allens book on Burma does cover the crossing of the Irrawaddy, although a look at the Burma Star website has the text as well I recall.

    My gf was a soldier in The S Lancs from 1941 until 1946, mainly HQ, then 9th Battalion, then 2nd Battalion from late '44 until wounded and returned late 1945.

    You def need to apply for his service history, his service number will help immensely.


  7. Pete Keane

    Pete Keane Senior Member

    Drew - remind me which diaries you have?
  8. Pete Keane

    Pete Keane Senior Member


    As an aside, the Regiment was called The Prince of Wales Volunteers (South Lancashire) until 1938, when it became The South Lancashire Regiment (Prince of Wales Volunteers) in 1938.

  9. Pete Keane

    Pete Keane Senior Member

  10. Pete Keane

    Pete Keane Senior Member

    Hi Chris,

    Your father is mentioned in the Spring 1939 edition of the Regimental Chronicle.

    On the seniority roll of Corporals, Sinnett, F as 12th in line of seniority, he was promoted to Corporal on 1st July 1937.

    At that time he was in the 1st Battalion. They were stationed in Dover, and were the Home Service Battalion of the Regiment at that time.

    His service history will give you full info.

    There is nothing in the way of photo's i'm afraid (thought we had got lucky but the photo was of a Pte Sinnott).


  11. chris-s

    chris-s Junior Member

    Thank You all for your (very fast) response, having looked at Gary D 's photos
    I vaguely remember a photo of my father (dated 1931 or 1932) captioned "my first Tiger" with him stood in a big game hunter pose standing over a dead Tiger.
  12. Pete Keane

    Pete Keane Senior Member

    Do you have his service medals?

    Service history is the way forward, once you have that you can follow his career.


  13. chris-s

    chris-s Junior Member

    No unfortunately I don't have anything at all,
    I know he had the Burma Star & I think he was once 'Mentioned in Dispatches' and thats it I'm afraid,
    I'm sorry I cant be of more help, but its just so long ago.
    I found a photo which I am 99% sure is him but I cant work out how to put it in a post, but I will try and post it again later.
  14. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

  15. bamboo43

    bamboo43 Very Senior Member

    Hi Chris,

    You could try and find his 'Mention in despatches' on the London Gazette website. This might give you his service number.
  16. englandphil

    englandphil Very Senior Member

    Chris, have researched the WW2 casualties of Widnes and the South Lancashire Regiment or a number of years now, I have been folloing the thread with interest, but have now had a chance to see what I can find, which i have to say is not a lot.

    The only record that I have been able to find his the record of his death in Southport, which was registered in 1970 as Frederick Grevase Sinnett. I cannot find his birth record or trace of him on the 1911 census in Widnes.

    I have also quickly scanned through the 2nd battalion war diaries, and cannot find him mentioned by name. There are a number of enteries that just mention RSM, and for a period of time towards the end of the war the Battalion didnt have an RSM, until a RSM Mclintoch was posted, so its possible he was either wounded or one of the many 100's that where hospitalised with malaria.

    The Widnes Burma Star association has all but folded in Widnes now, so not even sure if there is anyone around that could help.

    Pete, out of interest, the Pte SINNOTT you mentioned I believe was also a Widnes Lad by the name of Ted Sinnott, who went onto serve with 4 Commando at St Nazire where he was captured.

    Chris, pm me if you want anything looking up in the war diaries

  17. chris-s

    chris-s Junior Member

    [​IMG] I hope this works (1911 census) Hurrah yes it does!

    My father is listed as Frederick Kinsella (his mothers Maiden name) so he was possibly born out of wedlock.
    He later took the Surname Sinnott (note spelling) from his stepfather, which was then altered to Sinnett (with an e) when the army mispelled his name whrn he joined up.

    Attached Files:

  18. chris-s

    chris-s Junior Member

    I found this photo online, I think the soldier at the rear 2nd left could possibly be my father?
    especially when it is compared with the photo of him taken in the 1950s 12 to 15 years later.

    Does anyone have any idea about the insignia/badges on the upper sleeve?

    Attached Files:

  19. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Does anyone have any idea about the insignia/badges on the upper sleeve?

    Cant see any.
    Which chap has them ?
  20. chris-s

    chris-s Junior Member

    Cant see any.
    Which chap has them ?

    The soldier at the rear 2nd left, on his left shoulder/arm,

    what do you think? is it rank marking ? or even a military marking at all?

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