Hello all Is there any way of me determining which ship my Grandfather (James William Alfred Condron) sailed on with the 53rd Field Regiment R.A. when he left the Clyde on 17 July 1942 bound for Egypt. Believe he was part of convoy WS21P. There were 5 ships in the convoy: Empress of Japan Duchess of Atholl Oronsay Windsor Castle Duchess of York Can anyone narrow it down further than that? Would really appreciate any help. James
You may or may not find the information here: WINSTON SPECIALS The unit war diary is very likely to mention it, is it not?
WS 21P From: CLYDE Friday, 17 July 1942. To: FREETOWN Monday, 27 July 1942 AMERICAN MANUFACTURER Amer 6,678 1941 BUXTON ESCORT 17/07 - 20/07 DUCHESS OF ATHOLL Br 20,119 1928 4114 TROOPS DUCHESS OF YORK Br 20,021 1929 4004 TROOPS EMPIRE ORIOLE EMPRESS OF JAPAN Br 26,032 1930 4337 TROOPS EXHIBITOR Amer 6,736 1940 WITH DEFECTS GEORGETOWN ESCORT 17/07 - 22/07 HAWAIIAN SHIPPER Amer 7,775 1941 MORMACDALE Amer 6,976 1942 NEPAL ESCORT 17/07 - 27/07 ORION ESCORT 17/07 - 27/07 ORONSAY Br 20,043 1925 4348 TROOPS SANTA CRUZ Amer 6,925 1941 SEATRAIN TEXAS Amer 8,108 1940 DETACHMENT DATE ESTIMATED TARN TJERK HIDDES ESCORT 17/07 - 27/07 WINDSOR CASTLE Br 19,141 1922 2494 TROOPS ZAANDAM Arnold Hague convoy database - misc convoys TD
From Arthur Hague's Convoyweb site: WS 21P - Freetown 27/07/42, Capetown 13/08/42, Aden 29/08/42. War Diary will almost show ship Regt was embarked in. All the ones I've seen do. Charley Fortnum - Many thanks for link to Winston Specials. Never heard of it before and have just read review. It may answer some of my own questions so I'll get a copy from Amazon. Tim
On the completely random chance that you are interested in W.S. 2, I have a copy of that section you could have. (kindly supplied by Bamboo43, of this parish)
Thanks very much. Have just consulted the war diaries and it does indeed show that the 53rd were on the Duchess of Atholl. I don't know why I didn't think to look there. Thanks everyone. I might get the book too. There's a good account on the bbc site of another soldier on the ship: BBC - WW2 People's War - Life in the Army - Chapter 10 - The Second Part of My War
Thanks but my primary interest is in WS12Z and after splitting DM1. However the book looks very interesting.. Tim
James and Tim. If you give me 24 hours or so, I'll gladly scan the relevant pages from the WS book. I'm thinking that is 21P and 12Z respectively.
Yes please. WS12Z departed Clyde 13 Nov 42 (actually 2345 on 12 Nov) for Durban via Freetown. If the book covers it DM1 Durban to Malaya arrivied Singapore 13 Feb. Very kind of you, absolutely no rush. Tim
That was quick and very very many thanks. A quick scan through shows up some additional info. I see WS12Z was changed from WS13. The 6HAA and the 35th should have got the message earlier - embarking on the Empress of Japan, sailing for all practical purposes on 13 Nov, arriving in Singapore on 13 Jan and at Dock 13 in Keppel Harbour!! Tim
Hi Tim, Glad the pages were of interest. The book is very well researched, albeit a little dry as a full read. It has proven to be an excellent reference tool however, I picked out the convoy which took my grandfather to India in mid-1942; although I cannot narrow him down to any particular ship. Steve
I know the 35th LAA were on the Empress of Japan transferring to the Narkunda at Durban from several sources but in particular the War Diary. The book seems to think they embarked on the Narkunda in the Clyde but that is definitely incorrect. One point I will have to check again is the book states SS Sussex unloaded the AA guns, I had always believed that the guns were on one of the ships that went to Bombay and the were re-armed from Singapore stocks. I may well have been wrong as the War Diary makes no mention of it. Thanks again. Tim
Sorry Tim, I should have thought of this before. Please find attached the Chapter Notes for WS 12Z. These might be of use to you.
Steve, Thanks for that. Still doesn't answer the question of the guns! They should have had 18 per Battery but they only deployed 12 per Battery in Singapore. However I think I know where the answer may lie, just I can't get to the record just yet. Many thanks, Tim