I think it was Stalingrad. Imagine if Goofy was in WW2 Goofy- "Shucks" Mickey- "Shut up you idiot!" Goofy- "Shucks" Mickey- "Shut up you idiot
i'd have to say Normandy because that operation gave us the much needed foothold of france and a clear path to Germany. by the way im new, im johns friend, David
Goofy- "Shucks" Mickey- "Shut up you idiot Hi David. Normandy is underated. So many many... So many causulties... it's sad. They had mothers... they had babies...
I doubt if there was one turning point but each Theatre had its own keypoint. For what its worth Russia - Kursk After that the Germans were on the defensive. Had the Germans won they would have broken the back of the Russian armoured forces. Japan - Pearl Harbour In the end the USA would have won whatever happened, even if they had lost Midway so the start is the turing point. Middle East - Alemain Europe - Normandy Once we were ashore there was no going back
(Glider @ Feb 11 2006, 02:50 PM) [post=45603]I doubt if there was one turning point but each Theatre had its own keypoint. For what its worth Russia - Kursk After that the Germans were on the defensive. Had the Germans won they would have broken the back of the Russian armoured forces. Japan - Pearl Harbour In the end the USA would have won whatever happened, even if they had lost Midway so the start is the turing point. Middle East - Alemain Europe - Normandy Once we were ashore there was no going back [/b] Fair synopsis Glider. I'll go along with that!
From a Veteran that experienced the times. The Victory in North Africa was surely the pivital point in the war. from then on, it swung the Allies way with increasing strength, From that point on... they never looked back. Was it Churchill that said "This is not the beginning of the end, but it may be the end of the beginning" Or words to that effect........ I well recall the general feeling that was around that the tide had turned. Not a flood tide, but a steady but relentless move our way, that was not to be denied. Sapper
Stalingrad,The realisation that Hitler's folly had driven Germany into a war of two fronts and they would have to pay the price. It has to be.The Eastern front was a destroyer of the German war economy and manpower mincing machine,a giant minching machine which gave Hitler no respite.No matter what numbers Hitler put in the field,Russia would always find the manpower to achieve superiority in numbers. After Stalingrad,ardent Nazis and those in the Wehrmacht leadership used the excuse of being the protectors of Western Europe against communism.They also knew that Germany would have to pay retribution for its orgy of murder in the East and it must have dawned on them that the talk of a 1000 year Reich was really propaganda.Confidence in the Nazi war machine drifted into decline especially with a Supreme Commander having no other tactic other than never yielding ground no matter what the circumstances.
The exact words were "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. but it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning." I would agree with you sapper about North Africa.
In my opinion! 1941 22juni when A.Hitler and german nation started the war with Soviets and pervent them! Thenks for Germans Soviets didn´t arrive in France, Britan........ And didnt came out on Atlantic ocean! If Soviets would started first and crashed Deutchland/natzis, then nobody couldn´t stop Soviets! Then all the Europe industry would worked for the Soviets! Soviets becomed stronger than we can ever imagine! United States couldnt resist them alone. Ouer planet Earth would becomed a Red Empire! The Germans action in 41 save the world! The Barbarossa plan was the European protecion plan against Soviets!
Western Front: Battle of Britain - ensured a staging post for the re-entry into Europe. Eastern Front: Kursk - last German offensive, afterwards they were always on the defensive. North Africa: El Alamein - Signified the begining of the end for the Axis in North Africa. Pacific: Midway - signalled the beginning of the end for the IJN. CBI: Imphal - Stopped the Japanese on the border of India, they got no further and the allies began to push them back steadily through 1944 and 45.
(Flakfire @ Feb 13 2006, 04:09 PM) [post=45766]In my opinion! 1941 22juni when A.Hitler and german nation started the war with Soviets and pervent them! Thenks for Germans Soviets didn´t arrive in France, Britan........ And didnt came out on Atlantic ocean! If Soviets would started first and crashed Deutchland/natzis, then nobody couldn´t stop Soviets! Then all the Europe industry would worked for the Soviets! Soviets becomed stronger than we can ever imagine! United States couldnt resist them alone. Ouer planet Earth would becomed a Red Empire! The Germans action in 41 save the world! The Barbarossa plan was the European protecion plan against Soviets! [/b] Whilst I don't agree with it all, its a different view I admit, with a certain logic.
(Glider @ Feb 13 2006, 05:05 PM) [post=45784](Flakfire @ Feb 13 2006, 04:09 PM) [post=45766]In my opinion! 1941 22juni when A.Hitler and german nation started the war with Soviets and pervent them! Thenks for Germans Soviets didn´t arrive in France, Britan........ And didnt came out on Atlantic ocean! If Soviets would started first and crashed Deutchland/natzis, then nobody couldn´t stop Soviets! Then all the Europe industry would worked for the Soviets! Soviets becomed stronger than we can ever imagine! United States couldnt resist them alone. Ouer planet Earth would becomed a Red Empire! The Germans action in 41 save the world! The Barbarossa plan was the European protecion plan against Soviets! [/b] Whilst I don't agree with it all, its a different view I admit, with a certain logic. [/b] No, I can't agree, and don't see the logic. When Hitler unleashed the invasion of Russia, he also unleashed his Einsatzkommandos on Russia, and the cold-blooded butchering of every Jew he could lay his hands on. The Germans only claimed to be defending Europe from the Bolshevik hordes after Stalingrad, and they were in retreat. While I have little love for Stalin and his paranoia, I regard Hitler and his race-based obsession with genocide and destruction as far worse. Nazism was sadism writ large. It had to be crushed.
All turning points yes but it seems that everyone has failed to mention the vital intelligence carried out at Bletchley Park? With out this important achievement during the early part of the war, Britain would have certainly been strangled into submission by the superior tactics of Hitler’s U-boats. Not difficult to see when you consider the appalling loss of shipping at that time. The cracking of the Enigma code by members of the Bletchley Military Intelligence team, such as mathematical genius Alan Turing, helped turn the U-boat war round for the whole Allied War effort. Whilst on the subject of ‘Wolf Packs’, wasn’t it Churchill that said ‘The only thing that truly scared me during the war was the Battle of The Atlantic’….? http://www.bletchleypark.org.uk/ Nick Clark www.harry-tates.org.uk PS Don’t even get me started on RN counter mine Intelligence!
I would have to say Stalingrad. It depends on your perpective though. Certainly the German's saw it as a turning point and started their total war mobilisation. 1941 22juni when A.Hitler and german nation started the war with Soviets and pervent them! The Germans action in 41 save the world! The Barbarossa plan was the European protecion plan against Soviets! An interesting perspective. Certainly it was the Nazi one (and many thousands of non German Europeans who joined the SS). There is some evidence that Stalin was planning to attack Germany in 1942/3 although I wouldn't like to attempt to defend such an assertion. This opinion isn't quite as off the wall as people may imagine if they step back and think about it (Stalin had attacked Finland, Poland and had gobbled up a number of Eastern European states). Communism also quite clearly believed in helping other country's citizens liberate themselves from their capitalist overlords so it should not have been a surprise to anyone if the USSR did have plans to attack Western Europe. Certainly the USSR was happy to "liberate" Eastern Europe right up until communism colapsed in the late 1980s.
Every one has their own 'turning point'. For me it is the Dams raids of May 1943, but that's because I'm biased. It gave Germany one hell of a shock, and gave Britain the psychological lift it needed in Europe. In Africa it had to be El Alamein. In the Pacific i think Iwo Jima, as that was when Japan was finally finished, it was just a home run from there. (Jimbo, please don't jump on me for that comment.) In Russia I do not know as I have never read anything of the Eastern War. But each Turning Point is personal to whoever is reading it. But as to Germany 'saving' us from a Communist Europe. I understand the argument, and in a way i agree with it, but dude, you realy need to think through your arguments before posting them down.
Hitler always had Lebensraum on his agenda which Stalin, lulled into complacency by the 10 year German/Russian non aggression pact of August 1939 did not take seriously.Hitler, for ever postulating against the shackles of Versailles had always thought that Germany's natural sphere of interest was the vast spaces of Russia.Hitler equated the Third Reich's greatness and power with territorial gains and for Hitler it could only lead to Russia after Austra,Poland and Czechoslovakia had been brought into the empire of the Third Reich. The launch of Barbarossa,even then did not wake up Stalin.Russian forward units were told not to return fire until it was obvious that a full scale invasion had taken place.In addition,Stalin failed to believe intelligence from Britain that Hitler was preparing to move East.He could not believe that Hitler would tear up their pact. Barbarossa was never intended to protect any European against Russia,it was merely the move to seize Russian territory for "Germanisation" up to the Urals and take its grain,oil and mineral wealth for as he saw it a short war.It might have gone under the guise of a crusade against Russian communism being driven by Hitler's hate of bolshevism but the real motivation was expansion of his empire. Stalin's seizure of the Baltic States was the direct result of the accomodation understood between Stalin and Hitler.Stalin could take what he wanted on the Baltic in his sphere of influence and as far as Stalin was concerned he was willing to allow Hitler to deal with the "bastards of Versailles" as Hitler referred to the Polish nation so as long as Stalin could take a slice of Eastern Poland as buffer territory. Hitler himself was confident that Britain would not go to war over Poland, he had been advised by Ribbentrop who professed to have a good relationship with those of political influence within Britain that the British nation was decadent and would not go to war over Poland.Afterall Britain had aquired a laissez faire track record in the outcome of Czechoslovakia. This recently new posted appraisal regarding Hitler's motivation for invading Russia is possibly linked to the wishful thinking of Himmler and his cohorts who seriously thought that the Western Allies would have rearmed the Wehrmacht in the spring of 1945 and pushed the Red Army back to Russia.
