The Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders 8th Battalion, 1940 - Somme Bay Area - France

Discussion in '1940' started by Xavier Versmessen, May 7, 2020.

  1.  I am a Belgian amateur historian. I have a holiday home in Pendé-Somme bay area- France. At the local cemetery 6 soldiers of the 8th batallion Argyl and Sutherlands Highlanders are buried. All of them died on June 5, 1940. I would like to write an article about the fighting on this day in that particular area. Is it possible to obtain the exact circumstances of the fightings that day and about the deaths of these brave men or can anyone suggest a source where i can find the information. The names of these soldiers are: Cpl John MacDonald 3132142 / Pvt James Morrison 2984602 / Pvt Dugald McLugash 2981742 / Pvt John Chapman 2982721 / Pvt Robert Campbell 297801 and Pvt David McArthur 2981742. So far i haven't found much information but there is a book about that particular batallion..
    Thanx in advance.
     
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  2. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Please don't use Pvt.
    They weren't Americans.
    British use Pte.
     
  3. Kiwi REd One

    Kiwi REd One Junior Member

    Morning Xavier

    5th June 1940 was the opening day of the German's "Operation Rot" (Operation Red) which is regarded as the second phase of the Battle of France.

    You might find some of the information in the following link to another page on this site useful, though it relates to the 7th Batallion ASH which was located next to 8th ASH in the line on 5th june 1940, slightly further inland around Franleu: 7th Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders June 1940

    There are others here probably better qualified to answer your question but I can point you to a book called "Churchill's Sacrifice of the Highland Division" by Saul David, which contains a reasonably detailed account of the 8th Argyll's fight with the Germans. Details here:https://www.amazon.com/Churchills-Sacrifice-Highland-Division-France/dp/185753378X

    Good luck with your research and writing.

    Cheers
    Peter
     
  4. Stuart Avery

    Stuart Avery In my wagon & not a muleteer.

    He is a amateur historian & he his a (New member!)

    Xavier, you may be aware of the History of the A.& S.H. 8TH BATT 1939.47 Lt-Col. A. D. Malcolm O.B.E. ? I think you need to be looking at pages 9-51? I will have a read of the pages & get back to your thread if i can help you out? You could also try & obtain a copy of The History of the 51st Highland Division 39-45 by J.B.SALMOND.

    The last book that i can think of is the THE HIGHLAND DIVISION by Eric Linklater. Its more of a booklet. It may have more detail?

    Good luck.

    Regards,
    Stu.
     
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  5. Sorry Owen , as a Belgian i was not aware of that
     
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  6. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    From Salmond The History of The 51st Highland Division.
    Pages 10 & 12.
    Page 11 is a basic map not worth posting.
     

    Attached Files:

  7. Thanx Owen, very helpful.
     
  8. Hello Peter , just bought the book "After Dunkirk : Churchills-Sacrifice-Highland-Division" . Thanx for the tip.
     
  9. dryan67

    dryan67 Senior Member

    I have a copy of Malcolm's history. I am off right now, but I will take a look later to see what I can find.
     
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  10. MarkN

    MarkN Well-Known Member

    Salut,

    I am sure Drew has already posted the relevant pages of both the 7ASH and 8ASH WDs on this forum. Perhaps taking some time and doing a search will bring you some joy.

    The KTBs of the relevant German formations are also available online. Again, taking the time to do a search of the germandocsinrussia website could deliver some great info.
     
  11. Hello MarkN. Sure this is enjoyable but English is not my native language so this makes it all a bit more difficult for me. What are KTB's?
     
  12. dryan67

    dryan67 Senior Member

    Here are the relevant pages from:

    Malcolm, A.D. History of the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders: 8th Battalion . London: Thomas Nelson and Sons Ltd., 1949.

    A&SH01.jpg A&SH02.jpg A&SH03.jpg A&SH04.jpg
     
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  13. amberdog45

    amberdog45 Senior Member

    Casualty
    John is the son of Elizabeth & Joseph MacDonald, Perceton, Ayrshire, Scotland. There are 9 No. John MacDonald's that died in 1940 on military service in the Scotlandspeople website. Without an age for him, I can't tell which record.

    Casualty
    No family details for James, but age 27 and service return recorded at Scotlandspeople.

    Casualty
    Dugald's death is not registered in the service returns at Scotlandspeople. CWGC details say he is the son of Dugald McLugash & Janet McArthur.
    They married in the Parish of Kilchornam, Islay, Argyllshire and there was a Dugald McLugash born 1918 at Kilchorman.

    Casualty
    No family details at CWGC, but age 24 and service return at Scotlandspeople.

    Casualty
    Age 26 and son of Archibald & Catherin Campbell, Whithorn, Wigtonshire and death registered in service returns at Scotlandspeople.

    Casualty
    No service return at Scotlandspeople, age 24.
     
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  14. MarkN

    MarkN Well-Known Member

    Salut,

    KTB = Kriegstagebuch = War diary = WD = Journal de guerre = Oorlogsdagboek
     
  15. Kiwi REd One

    Kiwi REd One Junior Member

    Hello again Xavier

    The KTB's that Mark is referring to have all be digitised by a joint Russian and German project (the Russians captured much of the German Army's records at the end of WW2) and many of the records are now available to veiw online.

    The main German formation involved in the attack against 8th Btn ASH was 11th Motorized Infantry Brigade (Schützenbrigade 11 in German). The German 12th Infantry Division was also involved but its attacks were more directed against the 7th Btn ASH.

    You can find the relevent documents for the 11th Brigade here: Russisch-deutsches Projekt zur Digitalisierung deutscher Dokumente in den Archiven der Russischen Föderation | Akte 29. Anlagen zum KTB der Schützenbrigade 11 – Befehle, Meldungen, Berichte usw.

    My own interest in all this stems from my Grandfather's involvement with the 51st Highland Division. He was a regular Royal Artillery officer and was CO of the 51st Anti-Tank Regiment. He was captured at St Valery-en-Caux on 12 June and spent the next 4 years as a POW in various camps in Germany.

    I hope you find this useful.
    Cheers
    Peter
     
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