Signalman Sidney Seymour Smith, PoW Italy, died March 1944

Hi Anne and amberdog45

I have found that there are 5 family trees on Ancestry for Andrew Currie (b 1 Nov 1865 - d 1947 Ayr) with parents Hugh Currie and Mary Seamans.

However these 5 trees provide confusion, 1 shows him marrying Jeannie Innes Smith, but also shows a second marriage to an Elizabeth Reid (and a child from that marriage John Currie b 1892), which would be fairly difficult as the 1901 census shows he was still married to Jeannie.

Anne - if you go forward with your family tree then take great care about the information you obtain and ensure the sources are valid, dates match what you know for certain etc, this can be a minefield.

TD

edited to add reference link to other family trees:
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=pubmembertrees&rank=1&new=1&so=3&MSAV=1&msT=1&gss=ms_r_db&gsfn=Andrew&gsfn_x=XO&gsln=Currie&gsln_x=XO&msbdy=1866&msbdy_x=1&msbpn__ftp=Ardrossan%2C+Ayr&uidh=5nr&msbdp=1

 

View attachment Family Tree.docx I think I've captured all the info so far in this rough and ready family tree. Let me know if I've left anything out or got anything wrong

 

Many thanks TD. Added to the general confusion presumably is the fact that you might always stumble into a dark family secret or feud. I'm aware of having to be a bit careful in Italy given that as an outsider you don't quite know if you are talking to descendants of Fascists or not.......

Anne

 

Hi Anne
The tree looks OK but would add the info below for clarity and ease of reference:

Agnes Douglas Smith b 1885

Margaret D Smith b 1908

It sounds then as if we (the royal 'we' that is) need to verify that:
1. Sidney did/did not marry and have children (possible marriage 1930 - 1940)
2. Try tracing Margaret D Smith for marriage and children - (possible marriage 1930 - 1940)

I'm afraid there is not much more I can do as I guess this research needs Scottish expertise and access, which I don't have. If there is any more I can do, just shout.

TD

 

TD, no marriages for a Sidney Seymour Smith (mind you he could have married outwith Scotland) and I've attached all the possible marriage entries for Margaret Douglas Smith, his sister.

There were 2 possibilities, but neither marriage entry was for our Margaret (parents names did not match). The fact that Margaret used her maiden name when she registered her & Sidney's mothers death in 1962 makes me think she remained single.

I have however found what I believe to be Sidney's 1st cousins death notice in the Glasgow Herald from 1975.

There were 3 Andrew Curries that died in 1975. One registered in East Renfrewshire, one in Glasgow City and the other must have been recorded elsewhere in Scotland.

I checked the Giffnock address given in the obituary and Giffnock is a suburban town in East Renfrewshire. I'm pretty certain this is Sidney's 1st cousin.

The obit. mentions a wife called May Currie and a son called Andrew Connell Currie. There are 2 possible death entries for a Andrew Connell Currie (who might be Sidney's 2nd cousin) but disappointed to find no marriage record for any Andrew Connell Currie. So even if we got our hands on both potential death records for Andrew Connell Currie I think we could find he also remained single.

Anne, sorry this may be confusing you (my head hurts with it as well) but is this reporter that is helping you based in Glasgow? If they can't get in to the Mitchell Library to look at these 'Currie' family death entries I think that's as far as we can go with that 1st cousin.

I'm going to email the Aberdeen Registrars to see if I can follow up on that other 1st cousin (Mary Seamans Currie) who died in Aberdeen in 1978.

My reservation with Mary is that she married in Glasgow in 1920, yet died in Aberdeen. If she had children I don't know how we are going to find them with a name like MacDonald. And just to muddy the waters, Mary's husband has 2 death entries, one for McDonald and one for MacDonald!!

If they did have kids the search would have to be for 'McDonald' and 'MacDonald'. And you thought the name Smith was going to be problematic!

Onwards and upwards :P
.

 

Thanks TD and amberdog. Meanwhile I have joined Ancestry and messaged everyone who had set up a family tree which included Andrew Currie. Being a total newbie I've no idea if that was a good idea or if it will bring any results. Most of those who'd set up a tree hadn't been active for over a year, but one from Paris was on the site last week so who knows!

Amber - I haven't actually heard back from the reporter yet, I'm still awaiting a response to my email. However my inlaws are Scottish and live in the area and I may prevail on them or friends to do a little digging...

Or it's a good excuse for me and OH to make a visit

Cheers

Anne

 

Hi Anne

Joining Ancestry can be useful, I assume you emailed the 5 trees given in the link I left. In emailing them you have at least the satisfaction that you have done all you can, and also ....... you never know if you will receive a response ..fingers crossed.

It is easier to trace male lines as there names stays the same, I have nearly been caught out once or twice tracing females as they had married a second time or more !! although in this case amberdogs conclusions look highly likely.

I hope you have created your family tree on Ancestry, as you also never know who is looking/researching. I have made some useful contacts, one of which is a distant relation in one of my trees and also one who is writing a book on the surname of my wife and has taken that back a further 100 years from what I could find out from databases alone. So if members start downloading details to their tree, and their name starts becoming a constant in matching the same records, it may be worth contacting them directly, as they may have information on other parts of the tree you don't have and in a round about way it can provide you with new leads

Carry on the good work
TD

 

Thanks to Ancestry I have found a probate register for Margaret Douglas Smith. Seeing that she comes from Glasgow I reckon it's worth investigating a bit further. Her death was less than a year after Agnes (her potential mother), she would have died in her 50s but not impossible I suppose. Has anyone any advice on Probate research?

The entry reads
SMITH Margaret Douglas of 837 Crookston Road Glasgow died
30 January 1963 Confirmation of CAtherine Mary McAndrew
Smith or Black
Sealed London 20 May

Cheers

Anne

 

Hi Anne, had a look at Scotlandspeople and the Margaret Douglas Smith that died in 1963/Glasgow was 86 years old. I think that probate record is for somebody else as Margaret was born 1906'ish.

I take it you haven't had any response from the Smith Ancestry tree members?

I may get up to Aberdeen next week to look at the death entry for that person I suspect is his 1st cousin.

What area do your in-laws stay? I meant to ask after your previous post.

 

Thanks amber

I've paid my £6 to get her will now but you must be right if that was her age at death

In-laws live in Langbank, just across the Erskine Bridge from Sydney's home in Old Kilpatrick

Other interested friends in Glasgow and Irvine

Good luck in Aberdeen (I think the weather is better up there than down in Oxford at the moment)

Anne

 

PS - got a couple of "keep up the good work" from Ancestry members but nothing to get my teeth into

 

Hi everyone, I thought I'd provide an update on Sidney

I have found out a bit more info plus an article appeared in the Herald on 11th March
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/home-news/memorial-to-honour-scottish-pow-shot-by-ss-70-years-on-later.23652981

It appears that Sidney's 1st cousin once removed, Andrew Connell Currie, was a retired solicitor and died in Edinburgh 31 Aug 1992, though he actually lived in Madeira

The Informant was his daughter Jacqueline C Currie (1st cousin twice removed) who lived in Berrington Drive Glasgow at the time but doesn't appear to still be there.
I have contacted the Scottish Law Society to ask if they have any info on Andrew (eg the firm he worked for)

As for the Aberdeen connection, Sidney's first cousin Mary Seamans Mc/MacDonald died in Aberdeen in 1978, as we already know. The informant was her son-in-law B. McK Davidson of Smithfield Drive, Aberdeen

I'll write to both addresses just in case....and will consider what else I can do next

Anne

 

Thanks for the update Anne. In way of encouragement, I once read some back issues of the Burma Star Association magazine and found family requests looking for information within the pages. I replied to four such requests from as far back as 1979. I received responses from all four.

Good luck going forward.

Steve

 

Hi Anne, can't see any Davidson's at Smithfield Drive in the BT phone book on-line. I thought it would be easy to pin point his marriage as you would assume he married the daughter with a maiden name of Currie. Didn't turn up any Davidson marriages where the groom's first name began with a 'B' or with a middle name starting with 'McK'.

I'm heading up to Old Aberdeen to look at some Electoral Rolls for Aberdeenshire for my own family research. I will see if I can find the Davdison family in Aberdeen and see how long they may have been registered as voters at the Smithfield address. There may also be valuation rolls for the address as well, but that archive may be housed at Aberdeen Library in the city. Will let you know if I find anything. - Maria

 

Many thanks Maria. I've foudn the firm in Edinburgh that Andrew Connell Currie worked for (it still bears his name)

As for Aberdeen, I think the maiden name of the woman would have been MacDonald. I attach an up to date Family Tree since otherwise my head begins to swim.....

View attachment Family Tree.docx

 

While I was waiting to see the Electoral Roll for Smithfield Drive I looked up the marriages again. There was a May Smith MacDonald wed a Bertie McKenzie Davidson in Aberdeen Northern District in 1942. May passed away in 1988 (GROS Data Ref 302/00 0742) & Bertie passed away in 1999, age 78 (GROS Data 300/00 0212).

I found them both on the Electoral Roll for 1979 at Smithfield Drive. Nobody else with the name Davidson were listed with them, so no leads on their children if they had any. So back to square one. We're back to needing to see Bertie's & May's death certs to see if any of their children registered their deaths.

 

Hi Anne, I've dropped an email to Northsound, the local Aberdeen radio show in the hope they read the link to this page and take up the story on your behalf as time is running out to get a trip organised for any relatives that may wish to attend.

 

Many thanks Maria - did you point them in the direction of the Herald article? Always gives things a bit of spurious importance if it's already in the papers

Will keep looking even if we don't get rellies to the unveiling...I'd like to bottom this out and especially find a photo of Sidney

Anne

 

Hi Anne,

Is there any update on tracing the relatives, especially since the memorial is due to take place soon? Any luck via The Herald? I hope so.

I never heard anything back from Northsound directly so I put a request out on their Facebook page, but had no responses.

I've also found out that you can look at the Register Index in Aberdeen for £20 an hour. I always thought it was just available in Glasgow for some reason. I'm planning to book a session to hopefully tie up some family tree mysteries. If you still have no leads, please let me know and I'll look into the Aberdeen deaths from 1988 & 1999 for you.

 

Hi All

Just a quick update. I still have one 1st cousin twice removed to follow up through the Edinburgh law firm connection. I have been told that Sidney was actually a lawyer so I want to check that out with the Law Society of Scotland.

Meanwhile the unveiling ceremony has taken place, which was well attended by local italians and others, including a couple who remember Sidney personally. One was a 7 year old who remembers him coming to their primary school and reading them stories.

A You Tube link to the ceremony here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfAZy2J-RPI - but it is 25 mins long. Otherwise a report which I wrote is available here: http://www.msmtrust.org.uk/news/a-mystery-solved/

Many thanks for all your help, I would not have got this far without you. And if anyone is spurred on to find out more, I'm still looking and still grateful for any help. Maria, I look forward to hearing if your trawl of the Aberdeen register throws up any leads, and I'm more than happy to bear the cost

All the best

Anne