RE training in 1940

Discussion in 'Royal Engineers' started by ex-boy, Nov 1, 2012.

  1. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    I have recently obtained my father's service record and am now trying to make sense of it! He enlisted on 2nd May 1940 and went to I coy, 14 TTB (Technical Training Battalion?), then J coy 14 TTB followed by 16 Details Battalion before posting back to 14 TTB, all within a month. He enlisted as a painter and decorator and appears to have been retained as such until 1942, when he went on a welding course.

    I know he spent some time at Bordon in Hants on the military railway and later postings show him with 1 Railway Training Coy, 7 Railway Battalion and 602 Railway construction Company.

    Does anyone know where all the above units/sub-units were located in 1940 to 1942 and what he would have done as a painter and decorator in wartime.

    Any help will be gratefully received.

    Regards to all you founts of knowledge.

    Steve Gray.
     
  2. Oldman

    Oldman Very Senior Member

    Steve
    Your TTB could be Trade Testing Branch, As a painter and decorator that is just a trade or military trade.
    He would have trained as a soldier and a sapper doing all the things the RE's did eg; bridging, Mine laying and detection please general building, road a track repairs Etc.

    So we can help please post if possible his service record
     
  3. Wills

    Wills Very Senior Member

    14 Trades Training Battalion
     
  4. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    Hi Oldman,

    I will try to get them scanned and posted tomorrow, time permitting.

    Your interest is appreciated.

    Steve.
     
  5. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    Steve
    Your TTB could be Trade Testing Branch, As a painter and decorator that is just a trade or military trade.
    He would have trained as a soldier and a sapper doing all the things the RE's did eg; bridging, Mine laying and detection please general building, road a track repairs Etc.

    So we can help please post if possible his service record

    With a bit of luck, attached should be the three relevant pages.

    Thanks in advance for your assistance.

    Steve.
     

    Attached Files:

  6. Wills

    Wills Very Senior Member

    Can find Trades Training Battalions - even on friends re-united but not 14 TTB! The Royal Signals also had TTB - (General) Trades Training Battalions.
     
  7. RosyRedd

    RosyRedd Senior Member

    Although it says he was transferred to REME in 1942, it states he is on T List. As the units after then would appear to still be R.E. units, it could be the T list was a reserves list - someone else may be able to tell you otherwise.

    He is at a holding unit - not found anything for 7 Holding Unit.

    He's posted to 108 Coy for a day then to 6 Coy:

    WO 166/12009 6 Coy 1943 Jan.

    Then to 201 Section. Only file that seems likely as a match is this one that starts from November 1943:

    WO 171/1460 201 Sec 1943 Nov-1944 Dec.

    The only clear REME references I see are in 1944 - LAD 61st A/T Regt R.A and 3 District W/S REME.
     
  8. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    Although it says he was transferred to REME in 1942, it states he is on T List. As the units after then would appear to still be R.E. units, it could be the T list was a reserves list - someone else may be able to tell you otherwise.

    He is at a holding unit - not found anything for 7 Holding Unit.

    He's posted to 108 Coy for a day then to 6 Coy:

    WO 166/12009 6 Coy 1943 Jan.

    Then to 201 Section. Only file that seems likely as a match is this one that starts from November 1943:

    WO 171/1460 201 Sec 1943 Nov-1944 Dec.

    The only clear REME references I see are in 1944 - LAD 61st A/T Regt R.A and 3 District W/S REME.

    Thanks for the steer RosyRedd, all food for thought.

    Not being familiar with what has been retained, would the various orders for postings still be available and if so would they be at Kew or at a REME or RE repository? I'm close to the RE museum and the REME museum would be a good day out, so I will contact them next week to see if they can advise.
     
  9. RosyRedd

    RosyRedd Senior Member

    Steve, are these all the sheets you have regarding his postings? The sheet with part ii orders, posting, officers initials give the very basic info. Normally all the postings should be recorded on a page similar to the other sheet you've uploaded.

    The file references are for the unit diaries held at The National Archives, Kew. I don't know how much info the museums will be able to provide you with, but they may have information about the units you are interested in. Hope so!

    Jules.
     
  10. Wills

    Wills Very Senior Member

    One that has many leads that end up in a siding! After seeing the links to railway units I can find 8th Transport Training Battalion at Longmoor - 602 Railway construction Coy - but no lead to 7th! Will have another look. There is no doubt 602 existed a sapper is listed on a memorial (Portsmouth)


    The AGI (Adjutant Generals Instruction) 626/39 (1939) WOUM (War Office Manning)43330A (AGIT) of 17/8/42 this was an order allowing the compulsory transfer of men to a unit where skills (or shortages) may be needed. Prior to this a commanding officer or the soldier concerned could raise an objection.
     
  11. Oldman

    Oldman Very Senior Member

    Steve
    I like Wills can find no mention of 7th Railway (Transport Training) Battalion in any of my records, I suggest that you contact RE Museum and see if they hold any information.
    ORBAT does not show either 7th Rly (TT) Bttn or 602 Railway Construction Coy so a search of the National Archieves records mayh help.
    to do this go to the portal function and at the bottom on the left hand side is a search engine Arcre war diary.
     
  12. Wills

    Wills Very Senior Member

    Longmoor - memories:

    I was giving a lecture on field survival to a squad of female soldiers. Anyone who knows the area will know that there are hundreds if not thousands of silver birch trees (there used to be a pub the Silver Birch) It was a dank wet day - ideal to show the ladies - how to light a fire in the conditions. Stripping off a length of the loose bark I told them that it burns readily even when wet, holding it up I set light to it, oh JHC I was hopping around using the lingo barrack room - whoosh it caught my fingers as I tried to shake it off! The hysterical laughter suggested there was not a jot of sympathy!

    Much of the old trackways exist and are good for a run. Although the road system has changed since I was last there.
     
  13. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    Steve, are these all the sheets you have regarding his postings? The sheet with part ii orders, posting, officers initials give the very basic info. Normally all the postings should be recorded on a page similar to the other sheet you've uploaded.

    The file references are for the unit diaries held at The National Archives, Kew. I don't know how much info the museums will be able to provide you with, but they may have information about the units you are interested in. Hope so!

    Jules.

    Yes, I overlooked this one (attached), although it doesn't add much. All the other sheets are discharge papers.

    Steve.
     

    Attached Files:

  14. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    One that has many leads that end up in a siding! After seeing the links to railway units I can find 8th Transport Training Battalion at Longmoor - 602 Railway construction Coy - but no lead to 7th! Will have another look. There is no doubt 602 existed a sapper is listed on a memorial (Portsmouth)


    The AGI (Adjutant Generals Instruction) 626/39 (1939) WOUM (War Office Manning)43330A (AGIT) of 17/8/42 this was an order allowing the compulsory transfer of men to a unit where skills (or shortages) may be needed. Prior to this a commanding officer or the soldier concerned could raise an objection.

    I'm sure there are more sidings to come. I knew he had been on the Longmoor railway, as he was in Martinique barracks, Bordon for a while. He came to visit me when I was there during my service. Lots more to follow up, so I will get stuck in ASAP. I have been sidetracked by a thread on the War in the Air, but will try to follow both.

    Thanks and best regards,

    Steve.
     
  15. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    Steve
    I like Wills can find no mention of 7th Railway (Transport Training) Battalion in any of my records, I suggest that you contact RE Museum and see if they hold any information.
    ORBAT does not show either 7th Rly (TT) Bttn or 602 Railway Construction Coy so a search of the National Archieves records mayh help.
    to do this go to the portal function and at the bottom on the left hand side is a search engine Arcre war diary.

    Thank you for that. Will get on it when I don't have to rush. Maybe this evening.

    Steve.
     
  16. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    Longmoor - memories:

    I was giving a lecture on field survival to a squad of female soldiers. Anyone who knows the area will know that there are hundreds if not thousands of silver birch trees (there used to be a pub the Silver Birch) It was a dank wet day - ideal to show the ladies - how to light a fire in the conditions. Stripping off a length of the loose bark I told them that it burns readily even when wet, holding it up I set light to it, oh JHC I was hopping around using the lingo barrack room - whoosh it caught my fingers as I tried to shake it off! The hysterical laughter suggested there was not a jot of sympathy!

    Much of the old trackways exist and are good for a run. Although the road system has changed since I was last there.

    I was at Bordon for a short course in the late 60s when the Bordon Bullet still ran, but never went on it. Next time I was there in the 70s most of the track had been lifted but virtually everything else was still in situ. I remember seeing a few austerity locos at longmoor and a 2-10-0 (I think) which was about to be sent to a museum. It seems so long ago.
     
  17. borneo72

    borneo72 Junior Member

    There were still locomotives & sidings at the Ammunition Depot Kineton in 93. I believe they were run by a Railway Troop RCT.
     
  18. Oldman

    Oldman Very Senior Member

    Steve
    There are still ex WD locomotives (Steam) running on the heritage railways so the ones you remember maybe the preserved locos of today.

    Check out the The Stanier 8F locomotive Society web page it will give you information on the 8F's in Military use plus a Roll of Honour for all Royal Engineers who died in WW11 who were involved in railway work
     
  19. RosyRedd

    RosyRedd Senior Member

  20. ex-boy

    ex-boy Member

    Steve
    There are still ex WD locomotives (Steam) running on the heritage railways so the ones you remember maybe the preserved locos of today.

    Check out the The Stanier 8F locomotive Society web page it will give you information on the 8F's in Military use plus a Roll of Honour for all Royal Engineers who died in WW11 who were involved in railway work

    I do have a soft spot for steam locos (must be my age), so thanks for the info. I will find time sooner or later to look at them.

    Steve.
     

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