RASC, Motor Coach Company, Gilford Castle/Bannvale, Co. Armagh

I have now been able to ascertain that the re-classifying of Motor Coach Companies to Troop Carrying Companies took place when the MCC was re-equipped from impressed motor coaches to brand new purpose built Bedford QLT (where the T denotes Troop Carrying) 4x4 trucks which they gave the company an "off-road" capability. This then rendered the coaches redundant.

 

I wonder if the possible Motor Coach Company at Bannvale House was 3rd Motor Coach Company which does not seem to appear on the Feb 42 Order of Battle?

When did 32nd and 37th MCC's move to Northern Ireland?

Bill

 

Just by way of an update I have been trying to find the missing link in terms of being able to find what WD numbers civilian vehicles became and have been trying to find the comprehensive records created by the Vehicle Census Branch of the RASC. So far no luck. The RLC Archive hasn't got them and I can't find any trace at TNA. Can anyone shed any light on these valuable records?

 

Sadly, no. A list of "off contract " and impressed vehicles would be pretty close to the holy grail. I've only drawn blanks at The NA. In general, there is more chance of finding surviving RAOC records than RASC. I wonder if this is because of how responsibilities altered with the formation of REME.

 

I have now identified the location of this photo as being Dromore, Co. Down. This is a slighlty better view which shows the vehicle is a Leyland TS

 

Three years later and I am still searching for the records of vehicles impressed. When being impressed, the relevant officers created an Army Form W4003 which recorded the vehicle's civilian identity and would link it to its' "new" military one. These records were then held by the Vehicle Census Branch whose records are supposed to have been "meticulous" in detail and accuracy. Sadly I have been unable to locate these and am being further hampered by "AI" searches generating reports that these records were destroyed after the end of WW2.

A new "Royal Army Service Corps" group has appeared on Facebook and one researcher there came up with this AI result:

"Because the central registry of the Vehicle Census Branch (VCB) and Army Form W4003 logs were destroyed post-war, you cannot source a single, complete master file.To reconstruct these records, you must target the surviving civilian counter-records and unit-level logs across these four exact locations:The Kithead Trust (Worcestershire): This is your absolute primary stop. They hold the surviving local authority civilian licensing books and bus operator allocation logs. When a coach was impressed, the local council noted it in these ledgers (e.g., "Transferred to War Department, June 1940").The National Archives (Kew): You must bypass the vehicle databases and search Record Series WO 166 (Home Forces War Diaries). Look specifically for the 1940–1942 War Diaries of the specific RASC Motor Coach Companies deployed to Northern Ireland. The Quartermaster appendices frequently contain handwritten lists of chassis, engine, and impressed civilian numbers.Local County Record Offices (Northern Ireland / UK): For coaches requisitioned from major local operators (like Ulster Transport or regional English lines), the original company fleet lists, requisition letters, and financial compensation claims are often preserved in local county archives or PRONI (Public Record Office of Northern Ireland).The Military Vehicle Trust (MVT) & Specialist Registries: Specialist historians within the MVT and the Historical Commercial Vehicle Society hold privately rescued pre-war fleet books from defunct coach builders and operators, which have cross-referenced wartime requisition data"

Now where this search falls down is that The Kithead Trust disappeared in 2018 when it was absorbed into The Bus Archive and "Ulster Transport" did not come into existence until 1948 - the local operator in 1940 being the Northern Ireland Road Transport Board. These faily basic mistakes do not give me any confidence in what else has been shown in this search.

 

Sadly, when it comes to specialist subjects, "AI" mostly just cobbles together a scraping of posts from public forums with no form of fact-checking.

 

Some does much worse things and just makes stuff out sending researchers on wild goose chases. I had one where AI said there had been a former London Transport double decker at The Maze prison and even quoted a reference and supposed photo in a book. It was complete rubbish and completely untrue!

 

Do you have any of these War Diaries in your possession?

Bill

 

Nos.1, 2 & 3 Motor Coach Companies were joined by Nos. 32 & 37 Motor Coach Companies in late 1941 to take on a border control role - effectively all five companies were then operating in a QRF role (as it would be called today). Based on the supposed composition of each unit having 60 vehicles, that would make a total of 300 in use in Northern Ireland. Now when these units converted to Troop Carrying Companies (237,238,239,254 and 255 respectively) that would make them all redundant. I have seen the figure quoted of 229 going to the Northern Ireland Road Transport Board but believe the actual figure was more like 129? So what became of the other vehicles I wonder?