P/MX 58599 Petty Officer William Knox Orkney, RN: MID but no other records found

I wonder if anyone can help with this.

I am looking for information on a “Supply Petty Officer William Knox Orkney P/MX 58599" recorded in the London Gazette for 6 July 1943 as being “Mentioned in Dispatches" He was serving on HMS Isis.

Thinking that these timings would mean a medal award I have searched on the National Archives site but no luck.

I know that he was born in Ashington, Northumberland on 13 May 1920 and have found him in the 1921 census. He seems to be missing for the 1939 Register and I am assuming that he was already in the Navy but can find no further trace of him until a (probable) marriage in 1945. I have applied for a marriage certificate in the hope that might give some clues but was wondering if there was anywhere else I could look whilst waiting for it to arrive!



Any thoughts would be much appreciated

 

MerveG.

Mysteries like this regularly appear here, so take time to resolve, others a very long time. For a current example see: Medal display for Brigadier Reginald Francis Hugh Banister - need help

His name and number have not appeared here before your thread.

We have several RN / Merchant Navy experts here, it would help to get their attention by editing the title to include Royal Navy (The edit button is bottom left and it gives you the option to change the title).

Perhaps a visit to your local library (assuming you are in the UK) will help as many subscribe to the British Newspaper Archive (BNA) and only allow in person use.

Have you applied for his Service Record? That is the definitive record and is not available elsewhere online.

An online search with: "hms isis" site:ww2talk.com found a small number of threads here, most refer to the ship's sinking in July 1944.

What could be the action that led to his MiD? A good starting point is: HMS Isis (D 87) of the Royal Navy - British Destroyer of the I class - Allied Warships of WWII - uboat.net

 

Is this him 1939?

 

Thanks for the hints. Have seen the various articles on HMS Isis and am wondering if he was still on the ship when she went down?
BNA only throws up one article and that's about his uncle (or possibly grandfather - both were William Knox Orkney) being done for illegal bookmaking!
Cant work out how to edit the post title though I'm afraid

 

Last line bottom left has the 'Edit' button, click on that and proceed. For unknown reasons it doe snot always work for new members.

 

Ahh see it now. I can edit Tags but not article title. Have added the RN tag

 

...and I'm afraid that's his uncle in the 1939 register.

 

A possible source for the survivors of the 1944 sinking:

From: https://groups.google.com/g/uk.people.ex-forces/c/puduL3Ybz8A

Another pointer:

From: HMS Isis, destroyer

Note the Survivors Association has disbanded and the Local History Unit can be contacted on: local.history@enfield.gov.uk The catologue is not readily searched.

It was a grim day / night:

From: Memorials and Monuments in Portsmouth Cathedral

Just for info on location of wreck: HMS Isis sunk 20/7/44 — wreck location

 

Petty Officer William Knox Orkney was awarded a Mention in Dispatches while serving aboard HMS ISIS in 1943. The award was for service in the Mediterranean theater and specifically the sinking of U-562 on 19 February 1943.


Joined Flotilla for convoy escort and Fleet screening duty.
19th Participated in sinking of U562 in defence of Convoy XT3 NE of Benghazi with HM Escort Destroyer HURSLEY and aircraft of 38 Squadron RAF. There were no survivors See U-BOATS DESTROYED by P Kemp.

Regards
Hugh

 

I'm going to set the wheels in motion for his service record from the MOD but in the meantime am keen to find out if he was on the Isis at the time of it's sinking. Apparently there are were only 25 survivors and they are documented in a book "Just Ordinary Seamen" by Ted Tangye. Has anyone ever seen a copy/knows where I might find a copy (other than buying a second hand copy from New Zealand!)

 

Try: Royal New Zealand Navy It is on open access and it appears that the book's author's son Graeme may be able to help (his email is shown).

Or: Library Hub Discover - National Museum of the Royal Navy Their catalogue does not work and the search engine they refer shows No Trace for the book. Might be worth asking if the author donated a copy?

The only libraries shown on worldcat.org are in, yes New Zealand.

 

Hmm, looks like the RN museum in Portsmouth might have a copy...and I only live an hour away.

 

Hi,
Had a look at a couple of documents and he is not listed when ISIS was lost.

Have attached the list of survivors.

Regards

Danny

 

Thanks Danny, That's brilliant. Looks like William had left the Isis by then. MOD and his service record it is then

 

This is not a complete list of the survivors merely an update on those previously listed as missing. Naval-history.net says that the Admiralty list of survivors contains 45 names.
HMS Isis, destroyer

Tim

 

For info:
ADM 358/4375 held at TNA
HMS Isis: 20 July 1944; sunk by enemy action, hit a mine off the coast...


Admiralty: Casualty Branch: Enquiries into Missing Personnel, 1939-1945 War. HMS Isis: 20 July 1944; sunk by enemy action, hit a mine off the coast of Normandy, France.

Other references: ISIS

Held by: The National Archives, Kew - Admiralty, Navy, Royal Marines, and Coastguard
Date: 1944 - 1945
Reference: ADM 358/4375


Tim

 

Thanks all for your help on this. Am waiting on a couple of certs and will see how things pan out.

 

One of the posters on this forum has a copy of MEMORIES OF HMS ISIS – 50 YEARS ON & its supplement published 2 years later.
HMS Isis World Naval Ships Forums Archive

In notice there is also a copy of the book and supplement at the Caird Library, National Maritime Museum, Greenwich. Maybe you can get this on the inter-library loan scheme if Greenwich belong to that. The last time I did this for a biography it cost about £ 5.00 to order via my local library.

Travers

 

Hi,
I made a mistake when looking through the ADM 358/2342 and ADM 358/4375 photos.

I must admit I was looking for the surname Orkney and only did a quick comparison of a couple of the survivor lists to find the “25 survivors” mentioned in the post by MerveG.

Had another look and in ADM 358/4375 and it looks like there are over 50 names. In ADM 358/2342, Isis officer casualties, there is only one name.

Just in case they are of interest to anyone I have attached some photos with the names of survivors from the ADM 358/4375 file.

Regards

Danny