Help, please? I need an expert...

Discussion in 'General' started by Annie Taylor, Oct 13, 2021.

  1. Annie Taylor

    Annie Taylor Member

    Hello,

    Not sure if this is the place to post? Google is driving me mad and the reviews for 'Find Ancestors Military Information' websites are not giving me much hope!

    I'm doing my family tree (Ancestry) which is a puzzle within its self, but I seem to be really struggling with connecting the dots within Military sections. Ancestry doesn't give much information and I don't have much additional information to add. I just wondered how to go about piecing this together? The best websites, forums etc. I don't mind paying an individual/ subscription and I know not all records are available. I just wanted to avoid places like the gov. websites, where you have to essentially, 'try before you buy'.

    I just have no idea how to go about it and I the information I have isn't enough for me, a novice, to do anything with. So, I wonder if anyone could help, or point me in the right direction, or just let me know if it will be impossible.

    So here's all the information I have and what I'm trying to find out, if possible.

    (My Grandad)
    Henry William Welch, born circa 1924 in Hoxton, London and is to believed to have been in the Rifle Brigade around 1944-1946. (Never saw action)
    This is all the information we have on him. I would like to know if I could find a picture of him and if its possible to get his numbers. Some sites I've been on give me some information, but nothing that seems like a definite link.

    (My Great Uncle)
    John Samuel Welch born circa 1919 in Hoxton, London. He was a POW in Germany.

    This is all the information we have on him. I would like to know if I could find a picture of him and if its possible to get his numbers. Some sites I've been on give me some information, but nothing that seems like a definite link.
     
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  2. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Welcome to the forum

    Do not use pay for sites on the internet
    Other forum members will be along to offer advice

    The only place for info is in the link below
    You do not require their service numbers
    You require the below to apply
    Date of birth
    Death certificate
    £30
    Get a copy of military service records
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2021
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  3. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    UK, British Prisoners of War, 1939-1945
    Name: J S Welch
    Rank: Sapper
    Army Number: 2090630
    Regiment: Royal Engineers
    POW Number: 9267
    Camp Type: Stalag
    Camp Number: XX-B
    Camp Location: Malbork, Poland

    Maybe your Great Uncle

    England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1916-2007
    Name: John Samuel Welch
    Death Age: 77
    Birth Date: 15 Apr 1919
    Registration Date: Jun 1996
    Registration District: Hackney
    Inferred County: Greater London
    Register Number: A34F
    District and Subdistrict: 2301A
    Entry Number: 172

    Need a copy of this certificate if you apply for his service records

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    Henry William “Ben” Welch
    1922–2008
    BIRTH 1922 • Hoxton, London
    DEATH 2008 • Hoxton, London, England

    UK, World War II Royal Artillery Tracer Cards, 1939-1948
    Name: Henry Welch
    Enlistment Date: 10 Apr 1941
    Regiment: Royal Artillery
    Military Unit: 623 Regiment
    Service Number: 1795445
    61820_0061916_0202-01404.jpg

    623 INFANTRY REGIMENT RA(TA)
    623 Infantry Regiment RA(TA) - The Royal Artillery 1939-45

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2021
  5. Annie Taylor

    Annie Taylor Member

    Hey Tricky Dicky!

    Yes the photo is him, the ancestry account is registered to my dad.
    We done these search’s and have come across these before and we believe they could be them. That’s kind of what I was trying to do here, wondering if there’s anyway of getting any more information and “confirming” if it is him. I used the word loosely because I know it’s difficult to be 100% sure.
    Thanks so much for your help xx
     
  6. papiermache

    papiermache Well-Known Member

    Some National Archives have files you can download for free.

    The information from Tricky Dicky says your great uncle was at Stalg XX-B.

    Australian National Archives has a file you can download free which includes 14 pages of a report on conditions at Stalag XX-B. ( Note that the " Stalag XX-B" can sometimes be typed as "Stalag XX B" when searching for files. Rarely it can be Stalag 20B or 20 B)

    If you go to Australian National Archives, find "Record Search", then "Advanced Search" ( this is the bottom box "Items" ) then at the form that appears type in the barcode number or "Item ID" as : 6016779 you will find the file. There will be a symbol for a pdf of the file which click on, wait for a bit, and it will arrive. It is a 48 MB download.

    The report on Stalag XXB is at page 91 to 105.

    Screenshot from the Australian file.

    Screen Shot 2021-10-13 at 23.43.47.png
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2021
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  7. Annie Taylor

    Annie Taylor Member

    Thank you Papiermache :) much appreciated.
     
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  8. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    you say it could be him
    re your first post details
    are they the details you know or are they details you have assumed from various internet searches ?

    just checking because you could go along the wrong path if you dont get it right at the start
     
  9. Annie Taylor

    Annie Taylor Member

    Hi CL1,

    The only things we know for definite are what I posted in my original post, which isn't much.

    We've come across the things on Ancestry and 'saved' them.

    I wondered if there was another way to see if these documents were for my family.

    Thanks
    Annie x
     
  10. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Hello Annie

    you have all the experts on here who will be able to help

    if we assume your first posted details are correct then you have the info you need to apply for their service records which has been supplied by TD

    you have the birth dates
    you have the death dates

    with those you can apply for their death certs here General Register Office - Online Ordering Service - Login cost about £10 each cert

    then once you have them you apply here Get a copy of military service records at a cost of £30 each



    regards
    Clive
     
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  11. Annie Taylor

    Annie Taylor Member

    Thanks Clive x
     
  12. Annie Taylor

    Annie Taylor Member

    Will their death certificates give anymore information about the military? When/where he died, a 'definite' on his battalion etc..

    If a letter was sent to his family, informing them of his passing, do you know if there is anywhere to view these?

    thanks xx
     
  13. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    good luck with your research and keep us posted on how you get on
    if you have any other questions please ask on here and forum members will try to assist you


    you will only find their service records on the government link supplied you will not find them on the internet even if sites suggest they have them

    regards
    Clive
     
  14. Annie Taylor

    Annie Taylor Member

    Thanks Clive, much appreciated x
     
  15. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Annie they did not die in service so the death certs will only show what they died of

    your best bet is to apply for them first and then you might get other family details on them which will confirm if you are on the right track
     
  16. Annie Taylor

    Annie Taylor Member

    Thank you. Sorry I’m getting confused with another forum.

    I have a John Q who died of his wounds at France and Flanders during WW1.

    John Welch was a POW and Henry Welch saw no action.
    Henry is my dads father, so we have his death certificate & John married but had no children.

    I was trying to find out if the Ancestry search’s we have done and the limited knowledge we know, could somehow be ‘more confirmed’ to be them & if there was any other sites/ forums of where I could do some more research and find out their numbers, stations etc.

    Annie xx
     
  17. 51highland

    51highland Very Senior Member

    Find my past has 2090630 Sapper J.S. Welch, listed on the casualty lists as being with 218 Anti-Tank regiment, Royal Engineers when posted missing 16/5/1940.
     
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  18. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    I didn't know sappers had anti-tank regiments.
    Thought that was Royal Artillery.
     
  19. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Annie for WW2 and any other military search you are in the best place

    however
    re WW1 you can try Great War Forum whose focus is WW1

    others will advise once you confirm his exact name
     
  20. papiermache

    papiermache Well-Known Member

    Annie,

    The UK National Archives is usually referred to on the forum as "Kew" because the building is there. It is short walk from Kew Gardens tube and railway station. You can park a car on site, but there is a booking process and a fee.The National Archives website explains the procedure for obtaining a Reader's Ticket and how to book a visit.

    In contrast to Australian National Archives Kew uses commercial firms such as Ancestry or Find My Past to copy or digitise files. These firms then put them online and you can view them for a fee on your computer.

    If you visit Kew you can see the Kew files which have been digitised by the above firms for free on computer screens.

    For a useful guide to files at Kew relating to POWs search for The National Archives- click on "Help with your research" at top left of the home page - Second World War - Prisoners of War Selected Records 1715-1945.

    The guide is here:

    British and Commonwealth prisoners of the Second World War and the Korean War - The National Archives

    The guide refers to POW "liberation questionnaires." It is possible your great uncle completed such a form after the war, but the file of collected forms has to be seen at a desk at Kew to discover whether such a form now exists.

    This is the file reference:

    Reference:
    WO 344/338/1
    Description:
    WEDDELL - WELCH J

    John
     
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