Fighter Command Blenheims - a "funny"

Discussion in 'The War In The Air' started by phylo_roadking, Jun 7, 2014.

  1. phylo_roadking

    phylo_roadking Very Senior Member

    Guys, I've come across a "funny" when trying to track down information on a number of Blenheim squadrons turning up in Coastal Command availability in late September 1940. particularly - Nos. 53, 57, 59, 248 and 254 squadrons.

    On looking through 58 Sqn's website, in THIS page http://www.number59.com/new_59/postings.html I came across THIS comment -

    Is this the same case with other squadrons in that group above who were either Army Co-Op (Recce) postings in France with the BEF, or flying Blenheim F types?

    What initially attracted my interest was THIS chart of Coastal availability...

    http://forum.axishistory.com/download/file.php?id=326158&t=1

    ....where Blenheim 4F squadrons I.E. "fighter" squadrons are clearly marked and a distinction made between them and Blenheim IV squadrons...but as we can see from 59 Sqn and also 248 Sqn at least were Fighter Command squadrons for longer than is now attributed.
     
  2. aussie_59

    aussie_59 Senior Member

    Sorry to rehash, but seeing that I'm quoted, thought I should clear it up...

    "Correction - July 2012: I have previously stated that 59 Squadron came under the control of Coastal Command in April of 1941. Ross McNeil and Andrew Bird have since provided me with details that show that this actually occurred at a conference on the 26th of June 1940, "effective immediately". What did happen in April of 1941, (noted in the ORB and nothing previously in June 1940) was that the Squadron "establishment" changed from that of an Army Co-Operation unit, to that of a G.R (General Reconnaissance) unit (Continuing under the command of Coastal Command).

    Adding to my previous confusion... The History of War site states the following - "On 1 April 1941 No.59 became a general reconnaissance squadron, carrying out anti-shipping strikes, first with the Blenheims and then with Lockheed Hudsons."
     
  3. aussie_59

    aussie_59 Senior Member

    In answer (partly) to your question... Some Coastal Command Sqdn's are listed, if they were flying "fighter type" aircraft... What annoys me about the medals being revoked, is that (a) it's completely disrespectful it completely ignores the fact that 59 Sqdn aircrews (and many others for that matter) were right in the thick of the battle and [c] it's completely unjustified and incorrect to portray a myth that insinuates that fighter pilots/fighter aircraft & crews were the only personnel involded in the Battle of Britain, or worthy of recognition, in the form of the clasp...

    I think eligibility for the Battle of Britain clasp, should have been awarded in respect of duties undertaken, not the type of aircraft used... Personally, I feel that "The Few" is quite a few less than it should be...

    There was a thread started a long time a go, that someone had met a veteran (wearing a clasp) but they had not been able to find his name on the Battle of Britain Monument site. Turned out he was an ex 53 or 59 Sqdn member, who had ignored the Air Ministry, not returned his clasp and wore it proudly to official gatherings!!! Nice work!

    But, all just my opinions and thoughts...
     
  4. phylo_roadking

    phylo_roadking Very Senior Member

    Hi! Since opening this thread originally I'd come across information regarding No.59 Sqn elsewhere that does completely reflect your "2012 correction"...but I didn't come back and post it here.

    The basic issue remains, however...do you happen to know if it was only No.59 that was moved about organisationally from pillar to post...or did the same thing happen to the other former Blenheim Co-op squadrons in that OOB?

    I have to agree wholeheartedly with the shameful treatment that 53 and 59 Sqn veterans received in this respect; how were the FAA Gladiator pilots that were sortied during the BoB on several occasions but never made contact treated? Was the clasp withheld from them too?
     
  5. RAFCommands

    RAFCommands Senior Member

    The move of certain Blenheim units to Coastal was partly to give resource to a Fighter Command commitment that was relinquished by FC and duty taken over by Coastal and part to give CC a long range fighter capability.

    Actions in support of the Norwegian campaign showed the lack of a long range fighter/bomber in the Coastal equipment capability to support Naval operations. The Sunderland was the only capable aircraft with all other options still being developed or committed to other roles.

    with the withdrawal of the BEF to the UK the AC assets became available for redeployment and were earmarked for CC control.

    Pre June 1940 protection of East Coast shipping was classed as a FC commitment but it was found that FC control using the Dowding System did not allow sufficient time from RDF detection of the low level shipping attack to allow interception by scrambled units. The alternative was standing patrols, something that Dowding would not permit or could provide.

    The role of coastal trade protection was removed from FC and re-assigned to CC but it needed additional aircraft and this was again provided by the redundant AC aircraft and early introduction of the planned CC long range fighter squadrons.

    So not so much a moving pillar to post knee jerk as a pack shuffle and transfer of the deck to a new dealer.

    Ross
     
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  6. aussie_59

    aussie_59 Senior Member

    I think that the FAA Gladiator Squadrons were "attached" to FC during the Battle, so they were awarded the Clasp (post 1960) and are officially entitled to it... 804 and 808 Sqdn's. They were initially omitted in both 1946 and 1960.

    247 Sqdn flew the Gladiator during the Battle after they reformed in August 1940, They were omitted in 1946 but added in 1960. So although they saw little enemy contact, those aircrew that did fly an operational sortie from 247, are eligible for the clasp... I'm assuming that 247 was a FC unit during the battle...

    In my opinion... If you take a Gladiator to battle, you deserve a reward!!
     

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