Dunkirk Operation Dynamo Evacuation Beaches

I agree with Fossa. The 'F' is pretty visible and the rest fits.

Andrew

 

Re post #63

Jan

After your question about it I have been hunting around for a pic which shows the Barbara Jean location more clearly. Here is the one I had in mind. It shows the barge is on the beach on the other side of the Canal Exutoire - very close to the various bastions in the harbour. See pic attached and 'x' marks the approximate spot on the Google satellite pic.

Andrew

 

Hi Andrew I and Andrew II,

Well done on the Fossa, Empress (http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/1940/25808-unidentified-little-ship-wreck-dunkirk.html) and Barbara Jean! We've identified nearly all the landmarks on the beach haven't we!

@ Andrew (May1940): Andrew, you seem to have a big collection of May 1940 pictures! Would you have any with motorcycles that have been abandoned by the British Forces?

This looks like a motorcycle dump, close to the place where the Barbara Jean beached:





The beach in front of the Adroit:



De Panne:





But does anybody recognise this location?



Is that "CA..." a casino (Malo les Bains Casino or Malo Terminus Casino???), or is it a Café??? Which boat is that in the background???

Cheers,
Jan

 

This just get better and better!
Great work all, the definitive work on the Dunkirk beaches?
What do you think Andy?

Mike

 

Jan

I do have quite a few books, magazines and e-bay pics that I have saved. I am really more interested in BEF vehicles and their markings but these location puzzles are also good fun.

I have done my best with locating the motorcycles under the striped awning -see what you think.

One of the ships in the background to your pic (marked 1) does not seem to have been identified anywhere but it looks just like the ship behind the man's head in my picture of the Barbara Jean (copy attached).

The other ship in your background (marked 2) looks just like the Floride, which appears in another pic of the Barbara Jean from a different angle (also attached).

So both of these indicate your pic is in Malo les Bains. I have looked around old pics of the casino there but I can't recognise the brickwork in your pic. Nor can I find anything similar further east than the casino.

I therefore guess that this location is to the west of the casino for which I have a rather indistinct picture (attached). I have also circled the place on the Barbara Jean location picture.

What do you reckon?

By the way, I will look for any interesting motorcycles in my collection.

Andrew

 

Andrew,

Indeed, we seem to have another shipwreck here! All we still need to do now is find out which one! ) Thanks for your help!

DBF,

Oh, this is an interesting video! I just tried to put all the stills together, to give a wide angle view of the scene:

The first "picture" must be De Panne:



But this Dunkirk picture is very weird! I do recognise the Chasseur 9, but which ships do we see in the background??? Help, I'm lost!!!



Jan

 

Jan

Here is a motorcycle pic. Not sure where I got it - it is not one that I scanned. It may be close to your location and it seems to show 5th Division markings. I will get back separately with something on the Malo Terminus piers.

dbf

Thanks for posting the YouTube material. I have seen bits before but can't remember all of it by any means. I will work through it picking up stills of interest and trying to identify which ship (and pier) is which. There is a lot there.

Andrew

 

Fantastic You Tube video , gives a great indication of the scale of defeat and amount of equipment lost. Must be plenty of opportunity for 'then and now ' pics with stills from this.

 

Re post #86

Just to identify it - the wreck visible behind the Barbara Jean and marked number 1 in my picture is the Jaguar. This is confirmed by the website Index: Les épaves au large de DUNKERQUE ( FRANCE - Nord ) where it shows that it originally had three funnels but only one is showing in pictures of the wreck. So the motorcycles are at Malo les Bains.

Andrew

 

Jan suggested there might be several piers at Malo Terminus and I posted a picture looking back from the Batterie Zuydcoote which seemed to confirm that. I have found another similar view which backs this up. The pic is in the book 'Dunkirk 1939 - 1945' by Serge Blanckaert, published in English by Editions de Beffrois, Dunkerque. It has some rare pictures and accurate captions covering both our period and post evacuation. I got my copy off Belgian or French e-bay.

Our interest is in the background to Serge's picture. I have marked the attached scan as follows:
1. Malo Terminus casino
2. Wreck of Thames barge Aidie
3. Wreck of Thames Barge Ethel Everard and pier next to it
4. Wreck of tug Fossa (per Drew)
5. Wreck of Lorina. There are a few vehicles in the sea below it in the picture but as they don't appear to reach the shore I am not counting them as a pier.
6. Looks like the pier next to the tug Fossa in Jan's pic labelled 'schutz' in post 46. Note that it reaches the shore in this and the schutz picture (unlike the tangle of vehicles seen below the Lorina in Serge's picture).
7. Looks like another decent-sized pier.
8. Looks like only three or four buses but since they do seem to reach out from the shore I will count it as a pier.

What do you reckon?

Andrew

 

I've got Dibbens (rather good at first glance) book but it's not exact regarding the pier he thought about constructing. It could have been built on the 29th or 30th May and could have been at Bray Dunes or La Panne. He does state though it was constrcuted by 250th Fld Coy so I've added the diary to my list. Hopefully it will confirm a location and date.

 

Andrew,

Looks like the unknown ship in the "Ca..." picture is indeed the Jaguar! Well done again!

I've just re-sized the wide angle view in #88 post. Some observations:



Definitely Chasseur 9, so the German who's filming is standing in between l'Adroit and Chasseur 9. But which ship do we see behind Chasseur 9?



This looks like Lorina, which I thought was a bit further (closer towards Malo Terminus). I don't know any other pictures in which you can see Chasseur 9 and Lorina together...??? Was Lorina still afloat, and did the sea throw her a but further a couple of days later??? And where's the Port de Beyrouth tug???



Is this a fata morgana in the background, or do I really see the Dunkirk harbour, with ships and cranes...???



Could this be the Malo Terminus Casino? It's all a bit spooky isn't it?

Jan

 

I thought that was Dunkerque but I think that it is just the masts of the beached barges. It has to be a view up the coast.

 

I thought that was Dunkerque but I think that it is just the masts of the beached barges. It has to be a view up the coast.

Well of course! Why didn't I see this myself? I knew it couldn't be the Dunkirk harbour, which is "behind us", but for some strange reason I didn't recognise the barges! Thanks Rich!

Jan

 

Jan

The ship behind the Chasseur 9 is the Dutch cargo boat 'Horst' and you can see its picture on the French wrecks site Index: Les épaves au large de DUNKERQUE ( FRANCE - Nord )

Here it is:

http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=40126&stc=1&d=1289240544

Don't ask me why it and the Port de Beyrouth tug are in some pics and not in others - it must be to do with date of photo and the sea moving some things around. There is also the fact that various wrecks are closer to the shore than others which, combined with the angles, creates a misleading impression of what is near what.

You can see from the French site that Lorina is close to Malo Terminus. It is just the angle up the beach that makes her look close to the Chasseur 9.

As for the other two pics, I agree that these are the scenes at Malo Terminus in the background and the casino.

Thanks for resizing these and thanks for introducing me to 'fata morgana'. An interesting expression.

Andrew

 

Jan

The ship behind the Chasseur 9 is the Dutch cargo boat 'Horst' and you can see its picture on the French wrecks site Index: Les épaves au large de DUNKERQUE ( FRANCE - Nord )

Here it is:

http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39746&stc=1&d=1288714522

Don't ask me why it and the Port de Beyrouth tug are in some pics and not in others - it must be to do with date of photo and the sea moving some things around. There is also the fact that various wrecks are closer to the shore than others which, combined with the angles, creates a misleading impression of what is near what.

You can see from the French site that Lorina is close to Malo Terminus. It is just the angle up the beach that makes her look close to the Chasseur 9.

As for the other two pics, I agree that these are the scenes at Malo Terminus in the background and the casino.

Thanks for resizing these and thanks for introducing me to 'fata morgana'. An interesting expression.

Andrew

Andrew,

You're fantastic! Indeed, it is the Horst! There's something wrong with the picture that you posted, here's one from the french wreck site, showing the Horst and Lorina:



The nose of the Horst is facing the sea on the youtube picture, whereas on the picture above, it is pointing towards the west. It looks as if the ships that weren't torpedoed or shot below the waterline did come adrift at high tide. This makes it difficult to determine exact locations...

Oh, and here's another picture with the Jaguar:



Jan

 

There were also some aircraft wrecks on the Dunkirk beaches after Operation Dynamo. I wonder if we will be able to find out where they crashed...

Here's a Hurricane, and apart from the dunes in the background, there's nothing to identify the exact location...



Same plane, other photographer:



Jan

 

See my Walking...BEF thread. There's a few aircraft Then and Nows on the beach as far north as Nieuport.