Crew positions in a Wellington

Just had an inquiry from a mate looking for one of those drawings that shows crew positions in an aircraft. His Dad was a Nav in a Wimpy and I can't seem to come up googling one for him.

thanks all, for the assist,

cheers,
phil

 

Will this one do?

 

Well I am blowed. I dont have a cutaway of it. And me a Barnes Wallis fan too.
Sorry I cannot help.
Still, there is a nice picture of a prootype (?) Wellington on the Virtual Aircraft museum site
Vickers Wellington - bomber

 

Thanks guys. I will pass on the information. Well done!

cheers,
phil

 

Not sure if this guys (very detailed interior) model kit build will help, but here is the link
Wellington Mk.X, No. 311 Squadron RAF (Coastal Command) - Britmodeller.com
from his model build

 

Do they do a cutaway like that for a Stirling? :mellow:
Dee

 

pretty certain I have one somewhere.. hang on....

Dont know what has happened to my cutaway archive, vertually everything is missing
Anyway, here is one from the Flight Global archive. If you click on the link you can download a larger version
Short Stirling Cutaway - Pictures & Photos on FlightGlobal Airspace


And here is their list of 1903 to 1945 ones
Military Aviation 1903-1945 Cutaways gallery - Pictures & Photos on FlightGlobal Airspace

Terrible translation but good images of the stirling on this site
Google Translate

 

And back to the Wellington,

Here is the RusJet page (badly translated). There is no cutaway, but some interesting stuff all the same
Google Translate

This for example

 

Lovely stuff. I remember as a schoolboy standing in the fuselage of a Wellington at a Biggin Hill show while my father ( a Blenheim W/op & A/G ) described the spine-tingling sensations of taking off in a WW2 bomber.

 

Lovely stuff. I remember as a schoolboy standing in the fuselage of a Wellington at a Biggin Hill show while my father ( a Blenheim W/op & A/G ) described the spine-tingling sensations of taking off in a WW2 bomber.

Care to tell us more (hint hint ! )

 

Again, thanks lads.

cheers,
phil

 

My Dad was a navigator in a Wellington. One story I remember him telling me took place after they had landed after a training mission. The rule, on his plane anyway, was that nobody was allowed to leave the aircraft until both props had stopped rotating. My dad said he was standing with his noggin in the astrodome and he happened to be looking at one of the other bombers when he saw one of the crew of this other aircraft leave the plane and walk or run directly into the feathered prop where he was killed instantly. I imagine he had a few sleepless nights after seeing something like that, to say the least.

 

Yikes! I've heard this sort of thing from time to time, and can hardly imagine what the end result would be like, much less being the guys who had to clean it up.

cheers,
phil

 

Does anyone know whether the bomb aimer had a secondary role? The CWGC entry for Flight Sergeant Eric Gilbert Kershaw (KIA on bombing raid on Duisburg, 7th August 1942) states his trade as wireless op/air gunner, 7 Squadron's operation log shows him as air gunner (but doesn't show anyone in the role of bomb aimer). A secondary source identifies him as the bomb aimer. I'm assuming he was front air gunner during most of the flight and then took over as bomb aimer on the run in to the target. Is this a fair assumption?

Any advice greatly appreciated.

Regards
Pete

 

7 minute war-time Wimpy propaganda film with good internal shots.
Enjoy

Wellingtons At War 1939 - YouTube

Collers

 

Does anyone know whether the bomb aimer had a secondary role? The CWGC entry for Flight Sergeant Eric Gilbert Kershaw (KIA on bombing raid on Duisburg, 7th August 1942) states his trade as wireless op/air gunner, 7 Squadron's operation log shows him as air gunner (but doesn't show anyone in the role of bomb aimer). A secondary source identifies him as the bomb aimer. I'm assuming he was front air gunner during most of the flight and then took over as bomb aimer on the run in to the target. Is this a fair assumption?

Any advice greatly appreciated.

Regards
Pete

I think if you look at the Wellington crewing it could comprise of 5 or 6 and the latter was the reason for the Air Ministry to review the need to have two pilots.The other point was that there was two grades related to gunnery and the wireless operating functions.The Observer designation was a multirole responsibility who clearly had too a high workload to fit into the requirements of the 4 engined heavies.


Taking the 6 man crew.

Pilot.

Second Pilot.This crew member would be a pilot of less experience than the pilot (captain).The inclusion of the second pilot enabled a graduating pilot to gain experience of operations.But some aircraft carried a second pilot on the Wellington as part of the 6 man crew structure.This situation would have some bearing on the review by the Air Ministry of the need to have a second pilot and hence run the risk of the loss of two pilots if the aircraft was lost.

Observer.This crewman had a heavy workload and on the early types of aircraft that B.C operated,this man had the responsibilty for navigation and bomb aiming.So for these functions he would occupy the particular station for the particular role.Later the Observer role would be replaced by new entrants as crew men,the navigator and the bomb aimer/air bomber.

Wireless Operator.Before the outbreak of the war and in the early years,aircrew having the appropriate aptitude were trained in the dual role of Wireless Operator/Air Gunner in order to give crew flexibility of the aircraft being operated at the time.(The same crewman in the Hampden would act as the upper rear gunner and leave his gunner's position to operate the wireless.)

Front Gunner

Rear Gunner.

One of these gunners may well have been a Wireless Operator/Air Gunners trained with flexibility in mind as said.

The Gunner may well have developed his gunnery skills on the squadron and/or could have been a tradesman such as an armourer who in early war years was expected to resume his ground trade duties when not flying.This was to change when formal gunnery training was set up by the formation of gunnery schools and such aircrew graduated with the designation..Air Gunner

For the 5 man crew,the second pilot would not be included in the crew.This change came about on the introduction of the 4 engined heavies where the designation of Flight Engineer was introduced and the need for a second pilot was not accepted.This man did not have the extended duration and expensive training of the pilot.His role was to reduce the workload of the pilot by having responsibility for engine management, fuel and assisting in reducing the pilot's workload in take off and landing.He would be capable in an emergency,of taking control of the aircraft.This latter role was not reinforced by formal training but expertise picked up on the squadron.

As regards crew cover,there were at times when aircraft were short of a particular discipline.Cases are recorded of inexperienced pilots carrying out the role of navigating on an ad hoc basis with their navigation expertise badly lacking.A prewar Observer mentioned to a squadron C.O,should he be short of someone to do the bomb aiming,he would readily volunteer.Surprisingly the C.O called for his help and the Oberver having never flown operationally in a Wellingon before found himself in the job of bomb aiming,having never dropped a bomb from a Wellington before.

 

Harry, thank you very much. I must admit to having made a schoolboy error. George Kershaw was flying on board a Stirling. Apologies for any mix-up. I assume that this information will still be largely applicable to any large four engined bomber? Apologies also for sidetracking this post about Wellingtons.

Best regards
Pete

 

I quote Harry when saying: "One of these gunners may well have been a Wireless Operator/Air Gunners trained with flexibility in mind as said."

This sentence perfectly meets the results of my long search, mainly based on the Wellington bombers of various Squadrons that took part to the bombing mission on Turin from Oudna and other airfields on November 24, 1943.

Fascinating topic indeed.

 

Can you tell me where you got this photo of crew positions? I would like to use it in a book but need to know if there are any copyright restrictions...thanks for the help
billmeegan139(AT)gmail.com