hi everyone .this is all new to me so please bear with me. i am trying to find out anything about my father boat in the war he so i understand was a gunner on the city of manchester ss which i believe was a cargo ship that was torpedoed and sunk on the 28 febuary 1942 off the coast of java the lifeboats where machine gunned where my father lost an eye so like a lot of people he would not talk about the war years i can not find much on the manchester can any body help!
Hi Ivor and welcome to the forum. Edited thanks to Hugh providing the correct info and stop any confusion etc. Regards Andy
Hello Ivor and welcome, Drew you got the wrong ship. CITY OF MANCHESTER official number 164262 built in 1935 (Ellerman Hall Line). 28.2.1942 Torpedoed and sunk by gunfire by Japanese submarine I-153 (Nakamura), in the Indian Ocean SE of Tjilatjap, Sumatra, in position 08.16S 108.52E while sailing independently on a voyage from Pekan, Malaya, to Tjilatjap, with 6400 tons of general cargo including military stores. The Master, Capt Harry Johnson, 126 crew, 17 gunners and 13 naval signalmen were rescued by US minesweeper WHIPPOORWILL, landed at Batavia and brought to Fremantle by Dutch liner ZAANDAM. 9 crew were lost. As a DEMS gunner your father would be recorded on the ship's last crew agreement. If you need advice on how to obtain this document just make another post. Regards Hugh
The date is correct and the submarine that sunk it and then machined gunned the survivors was the Japanese submarine I-153; Ten injured survivors were transfered to the 'Tulsa' an American navel vessel. Sorry I can't help with more information.
I can only find two casualties between 26.2.42 - 30.3.42 on that ship: 001 ROBERTS G S - SS CITY OF MANCHESTER LIVERPOOL 28/02/1942 MERCHANT NAVY 002 TAWS S C S - SS CITY OF MANCHESTER LIVERPOOL 03/03/1942 MERCHANT NAVY
Hi Drew, Here is the other casualty. CWGC :: Casualty Details Some confusion on this one, as I have three casualties listed on my website: Ellerman Line War Losses However, some references have 6 others taken as prisoners of war. Regards Hugh
HUGH.thanks very much that was just what i was looking for . can you advise me on how to obtain the last ship crews agreament as i am trying to find his army number so i can get his war record .thanks again ivor neville
Hi Ivor, You don't need his service number to apply for his service records if you know his date of birth. Regards Andy
Hello Ivor, There is no crew agreement for the year 1942 held at Kew but I presume this is because the ship sailed in 1941 and never returned to the UK in 1942. The last crew agreement will be for 1941. This will be held at Kew in piece BT 381/1608 If he served aboard another Merchant Navy ship prior to "CITY OF MANCHESTER" it may show the ship's name on the agreement. It would be best if you are in a position to visit Kew yourself to obtain this file or get someone to photocopy it on your behalf as due to recent changes this file will cost you £45 to order online [yes, I know, a ridiculous price]. Recent changes at Kew are responsible for this madness. Note: Drew is quite correct regarding his service record but bear in mind if he served through the war as a DEMS gunner on Merchant Navy ships it is very unlikely that these ships will be mentioned in his service records and crew agreements are the way to go. This method also has its disadvantages. However, that said, you should always start research on a serviceman with his military records. Regards Hugh
Looking at his date of death Hugh, I'm guessing he was a PW? I concur, Drew, and should have spotted this file held at Kew in piece BT 373/62 I wonder how many of the 6 PoW, if indeed there were 6, died. If there was more than the one already identified could there be non-comms here? Will attempt to find out more. Regards
Hi Ivor and welcome to the forum. Here you can find a location where ship was sunk and here you have a photo of the SS City of Manchester. Cheers Enes
thanks enes. much appreciated i took months for a picture and you take minuets any more goodies much appreciated .thanks everyone. regards ivor neville
HUGH. thanks very much for info as a gunner he was army! would he be on crews agreement?. so i understand he was rescued by the whippoorwill and transfered to the tulsa i presume it was going to batavia .then moved on to fremantle .he was posted missing in action for about a year then sent back to england to recover he never served again after that because of injuries. i understand there was a army unit set up to man the guns on merchant ships called the maritime royal artillery i wonder if he could have served in that. thanks again ivor neville
Ivor, another nice photo of SS City of Manchester you can find on shipsnostalgia but to be able to see it you have to first join to forum. Be aware that there was other ships with the same name. If you will have any troubles to find it just noted me and I will help you. Cheers Enes
Before experts put us both right, DEMS ships *Defensively Equipped Merchant Ships) were a way of providing some protection to Merchant Navy vessels. Those whose size and structure allowed the installation of (sometimes antiquated) artillery pieces could protect a convoy from surface or air attacks by a lone U boat or aircraft. Obviously if a serious threat arose, it wouldn't stand much chance but it was better than nothing. It's stated there were 9 casualties. I suspect that either they were Chinese, Lascars etc or the Royal Marine Artillery men but as they don't appear as identified with the "City of Manchester" it's unlikely we will know who they were and whether they have their due CWGC recognition or not.
