British Kangaroos

Discussion in 'Vehicle Names and Census Numbers' started by KevinT, Aug 18, 2021.

  1. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    Attached are images of Kangaroos from 49th Armoured Personnel Carrier Regiment, 79th Armoured Division.
    The majority are courtesy Temujin and the Imperial War Museum archives.
    The image of REVENGE also shows RAIDER. The image of NEPTUNE is a bit of a guess on my part, I am not 100% sure of the name. If anyone has a clearer image of this please let me know.
    These images are for reference and research only.
    If anyone can add anything please let me know.

    Cheers

    Kevin
     

    Attached Files:

  2. vestingjager

    vestingjager Well-Known Member

    Very interesting.

    I only recently discovered that (parts of) 6th Airborne Division arrived during the Battle of the Bulge in january 1945 in Kangaroos. My best guess would be British, of course, although it would be nice if it were Canadians.

    Any information on the subject of their use in the Ardennes is very welcome!
     
    ecalpald likes this.
  3. Christian Fletcher

    Christian Fletcher Well-Known Member

    I can give you Armadillo's serial number. CT40703 (p82, "Canada's Pride")
    cheers
     
    Chris C likes this.
  4. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    Hi Christian,

    No problem I managed to find it on IWM film - West Front Report. However I am still missing a few 49 APCR numbers:=
    BRIGHTON II, NEPTUNE, NERO, NIGHTJAR II, RAIDER, REVENGE, ROTHERHAM, SAILOR and TODMORDEN.

    One image I forgot to post was KING JOHN ( Missing number too ). I will post it later.

    Cheers

    Kevin
     
  5. Not sure British or Canadian, but here are CUSTER and LIBERATOR:
    Ram Kangaroo xSTER.jpg
    Ram Kangaroo CUSTER.jpg
    Ram Kangaroo LIBERATOR.jpg
     
  6. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    Hi Michel,

    Thank you for those. What is your source?
    Going by the names like BRIGHTON II, NEPTUNE, NERO, NIGHTJAR II, RAIDER, REVENGE, ROTHERHAM, SAILOR and TODMORDEN I would go with British.

    Attached is King John courtesy IWM film archive - Battle for Rhineland pt 1, Operation Veritable - The First Three Days.

    Cheers

    Kevin King John Ram Kangaroo 49th Armoured Carrier Regiment.jpg
     
  7. Source: Bevrijding Enschede en Hengelo or Bevrijding Enschede en Hengelo - Open Beelden (couldn't find it anymore on the original location Zoeken Beeld en Geluid)
    Kangaroos from 05:40. Looking again more closely, frame by frame, CUSTER is probably wrong for the 1st pic above (xxSTER, beginning of the name out of frame), and definitely so for the 2nd, which does not show the same vehicle as I first thought, but another one. Looking at better frames we can see the name LUSTLEIGH:
    26157 - 06.20 - Ram Kangaroo LUSTLEIGH - Notes.jpg

    From 05:50 we see what I believe is LANGWOOD:
    26157 - 05.52 - Ram Kangaroo LANGWOOD maybe - Notes.jpg

    The name on the Kangaroo from 05:40 is too blurry, but appears to start with 'L', like apparently all other Kangaroos in the sequence (all C Sqn). Therefore xxSTER might be LEICESTER...

    This also confirms it's a British unit :D
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2021
  8. DaveB

    DaveB Very Senior Member

    I have lost the plot here a little bit - are you after any photos of Kangaroo APCs, or only of ones with visible names, or only ones in use by 49th Armoured Personnel Carrier Regiment, or only ones in British use, or??

    Anyhoo, here is SPEAR passing through Hopsten, Germany in 1945
     
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  9. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    Hi DaveB,

    The post is for named Kangaroos of 49th Armoured Personnel Carrier Regiment.
    There are separate posts for named Kangaroos of 1st Canadian Armoured Personnel Carrier Regiment.

    Thank you for SPEAR, which is a clearer image than I have. The location is new to me.

    Cheers

    Kevin
     
  10. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    Hi Michel,

    Thank you for these as always. I have run through the film clip several times and as you say the names are too blurry. I did catch this one at 9.15 which looks like LEVER but I may be wrong. There are 3 Kangaroos right at the end of the clip which are travelling too fast to read the names fully but there is a blurry OOD if you catch it right which may confirm your thoughts on LANGWOOD.

    Cheers

    Kevin Screenshot 2021-08-25 23.38.15.png
     
  11. Kevin,

    This one is LIBERATOR. I found it best to first download the video and then go frame by frame using, for example, MPC-HC video reader. This way one can select the sharpest frames.
     
    Chris C likes this.
  12. Do we know what the marking system for 49 APCR was? From what I've gathered so far:

    A Sqn - no tac sign
    SHQ + A, B, C & ?? Tps

    C Sqn - white circle
    SHQ + K, L, M & N Tps

    F Sqn - inverted white triangle
    SHQ + R, S, T & ?? Tps

    I believe we may safely assume that all twelve Kangaroos within the same Troop (four troops of twelve APCs to a squadron plus five APCs in SHQ) would have names starting with the Troop letter? What about SHQ APCs? The complete scheme might have been:

    A Sqn
    A, B, C, D, E (A or E for SHQ)

    B Sqn (reserved)
    F, G, H, I, J (F or J for SHQ)

    C Sqn
    K, L, M, N, O (K or O for SHQ)

    F Sqn
    P, Q, R, S, T (P or T for SHQ)

    I suppose that the War Diary could tell us the precise org, but I do not have it...
     
  13. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    So going by your marking system so far we have the following:-

    A Sqn ( A or E SHQ names ) ANARCHIST, ARMADILLO, ARSENIC, ASSASSIN BLACKPOOL, BRIGHTON (BRIGHTON II), BULL COD, COMET

    B Sqn ( F or J SHQ names ) GIRAFFE ( CDL )

    C Sqn ( K or O SHQ names ) KING JOHN LEICESTER, LIBERATOR, LOLLYPOP, LUSTLEIGH ( and possibly LANGWOOD ) MARS, MERLIN NEPTUNE, NERO, NIGHTJAR II

    F Sqn ( P or T SHQ names ) RAIDER, REVENGE, ROTHERHAM SAILOR, SPEAR TAPIR, TARANTULA, TODMORDEN, TYRANT

    Cheers

    Kevin
     
  14. Nice to see that CDL GIRAFFE fits in nicely with the theory!
    LEICESTER is just a supposition. If further naming logic was applied down to Section level (four APCs in each), it might be LANCASTER, by analogy with LIBERATOR...
    We have very few individual vehicle numbers to try and confirm this further theory:
    BLACKPOOL is B8, meaning fourth APC in 2nd Section of B Tp.
    MERLIN seems to be M12.
    ROTHERHAM might be R8, but this looks more like the tail of the Reg No CTxxxx28 (IWM B3648:
    ROTHERHAM in Rethem, 16 Apr 45 [Smith] - BU3648 cropped.jpg
     
  15. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    Slim but there could be county and other links.
    BLACKPOOL and LANCASTER are both in LANCASHIRE
    TOMORDEN (West) and ROTHERHAM (South) are both in Yorkshire
    MARS, MERLIN and NEPTUNE are all mystical figures.

    But then again......

    Cheers

    Kevin
     
  16. Could be, or some other logic, or none at all...

    I must amend my previous post, because I misremembered Trux's War Establishment. It's not three sections of four APCs per Troop, but three sections of three, plus two APCs for Inf Coy HQ and one reserve APC.
     
  17. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    One I forgot to add - CAPTOR. Image is courtesy IWM image BU 2846 for reference and research only.

    Cheers

    Kevin Captor.jpg
     
    Chris C likes this.
  18. stolpi

    stolpi Well-Known Member

    The Kangaroos were British and belonged to the 49 Armoured Personeel Carrier Regiment (APCR). "C" Sqn, on Jan 2nd,1945, carried the 13th Para Bn forward to Beauraing, but the Kangaroos were not used after that due to the slippery roads.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2021
  19. KevinT

    KevinT Senior Member

    Just found another.
    I think it is SOWERBY BRIDGE but cannot be sure. Any thoughts or confirmation appreciated.

    Cheers

    Kevin

    Screenshot 2021-05-09 19.13.30.png
     

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