8th Bn Royal Scots (15th Scottish Division)

Hi,

I am currently down a deep rabbit hole of what the 8th battalion Royal Scot’s did all the way from Normandy to Germany.

My great uncle sergeant David Douglas M.M served and fought with them from Normandy all the way Uelzen, Germany . This is where he was shot in the shoulder. He served as a signal platoon sergeant . He earned his military medal at the battle for gheel bridgehead between 14-16th September 1944. He kept communications open between by crossing the canal multiple time under heavy shell and small arms fire. What I’m really looking for is to know what company he was in himself, so I can follow his path more closely! 3056670 Is his service number.

any pictures of the 8th royal Scots or any information at all about what the battalion did in the NW Europe campaign would be greatly appreciated, as I caught the war waffling bug from a young age!

I’ve attached a picture of him getting his medal from Monty and also his citation

thanks for any info/pics

Lewis

 

Transcribed unit war diary here.

https://www.15thscottishdivisionwardiaries.co.uk/8-rs

 

Lewis
Have a look at the 8RS war diaries for 13 December 1944 in particular.
Interesting site here too (in Dutch but with photos): home | battleforthelocks.be
Adam

 

Fine mementos of a brave chap. The Signal Platoon was a Battalion asset and would have been part of Headquarter Company. The Signal Platoon commander was usually known as the RSO. The citation indicates that your great uncle had not been attached to a company or other sub-unit because he was continually moving between the forward elements and the Rear Battalion HQ (perhaps called Main) to maintain communications - the RSO possibly being with the Commanding Officer's group.

Some generic detail is available at:
http://www.bayonetstrength.uk/BritishArmy/BritInfBn/Org of the British Inf Bn 1938-45.pdf

which may be of use.

 

Thanks for this nudge in the right direction brings me great joy to read this! I’m gong upload a pic for anyone else that is interested !

 

Thanks for the reply!
I was struggling to understand where he would be when reading the units war diary but I guess he is kind of all over the place?! That link did help me to get a grasp of his job. It pieces together a story David told my dad. He must have been in the right mood because he told my dad he once killed a “grand young lad” coming round a corner in Germany somewhere , they met almost face to face and David shot him first. It must have been significant as he took the young soldiers knife from him. David’s own son must have one day asked if that said knife has seen much action. David’s reply was, aye it’s seen plenty action- it’s peeled many an apple.

I guess being a signal platoon sergeant you would find yourself in situation where you come across enemy alone going between company’s and headquarters. Making this story highly possible to have happened. Unfortunately David died at 91 in 2011. I was too young to grasp any concept of his task and only wish I could have asked him himself about his experiences!

 

Hi Lewis,

I check this website very so often to see if anything new comes to light about the 8RS. In short my late Father, John Robinson, also served in the 8RS during WW2, was a signaler, and his signals sergeant had been.....Davy Douglas. My Dad had served in Company 'C'. Hope this helps. I spent many years researching what my Father had done in WW2. Like you I wanted to discover as best I could every step he had taken through the ETO with the 8RS. I was aided in my research by the now late Major Joe Lawler Brown who chaired the 8th & 9th WW2 Veterans Association based at Edinburgh Castle. Prior to coming into contact with Major Joe I had already made a DVD telling my Dad's story in WW2 for family history purposes. With Joe's blessing I then produced a similar
DVD ..... 'Normandy to the Elbe' ..... telling the whole story of the 8RS campaign. This DVD Joe handed out to family wanting to know more about their loved ones involvements with the 8RS in WW2. Within this DVD there is film footage of the little boat ferrying across the canal at Ten Aard while the battle was going on. To me, it looks like one of the soldiers seen on the boat is Davy Douglas. You are quite welcome to a copy of this DVD if you would like, just let me know.

In the meantime, if you take a look at this website.........tottenham-summerhillroad.com. On entering this local history website scroll down to the bottom and left click on 'Enter'. When the next page appears left click on' What's New'. Then look down the list a short way until you come across 'Normandy to the Elbe'. It is a short account of Dad's own WW2 story that I added to the site.

I recall back in the middle 1960's my Dad getting all excited because he told me he was meeting up with his old signals sergeant, Davy Douglas, for lunch along Oxford Street in London where Dad was working at the time. My Dad passed away in 1996 at age 82.

 

Hi Alan,
I really appreciate your reply and I’m quite shocked at how powerful the internet is when it come to gather information and connecting people. It is very exciting to know your late father knew David or Davy as your dad would have called him!
I would absolutely love to have a look at that DVD and I will give you details somehow if that is possible! I am going to check that website out now as soon as I’ve finished writing this message! Any info or pics from your previous research that is easy to hand would also be a joy to look over !
If there is anyway to privately message you I will send you my details, but I just want to thank you for your reply it really has made my day!
Cheers
Lewis

 

Apparently thanks to Owen if I make one more post I’m allowed to start a conversation, so I will message you my email on ‘conversations’!

 

Hi Lewis, I was in the Geel Bridgehead this past weekend following in the footsteps on my mother's husband who was 6RSF which was sent to support 8RS and extend the bridgehead. The story goes that Ten Aard was on the planned route of the 2nd Army into the Netherlands with 15th Scottish on the left flank which covered Geel and Ten Aard.
Hope that helps.
Keith

 

Hi Alan, thanks for sharing your material which I checked out on the website you mentioned. I met with Gil in Ten Aard a few weeks back with an open invitation to meet again. He is hugely knowledgeable and a really nice bloke on top. I will go back alone to fill in a few details from my visit with him and then hopefully meet up with Gil again in September. Its only 1.5 hours from my home in the Netherlands having moved from UK. My interest is my mum's husband who was 6RSF who also took a hammering at Ten Aard. I am writing of his personal life before 1939 and then his war service until he was KIA crossing the Rhine. I think the Scots were magnificent at Ten Aard, brave and gutsy, but somewhat let down by the high command who rushed things a bit without proper reconnaissance only to find bridges blown at the last minute and then the ammunition shortage. I have stood in the main street, walked along the canal and walked around inside the bridgehead. I have the utmost respect for those that fought there.
Best regards
Keith

 

Hi, In response to your question, I would recommend you try and lay your hands on a copy of
The First of Foot - The History of the Royal Scots
Augustus Muir

It has a very good history of each of the battalions during the Second World War.

 

Hi Keith, I Wonder if you can help me too. My uncle was with the 6RSF and died at Geel in action involving a tank and a bridge, I understand. His name was Thomas Morgan (Tucker) he died 13th September 1944. Did your research into the RSF turn up anything from the action at Geel, or could you advise any websites that might have information about his company or platoon?

 

Hi Lewis, Did you find any information about the 6th RSF when you were researching the 8RSFs? I am trying to find information about my uncle, Thomas Morgan, who died at Geel on 13th September, I think in the action trying to take / keep the bridge. I'm a bit lost, so anything you van offer would be great, thanks,

 

Hi Lewis,
The Gheel Bridgehead you mention was at the village of Ten Aard, just north of Geel town. 8RS left Geel and arrived in Ten Aard before the other 44th Lowland battalions. They arrived on 14th to find the road bridge over the canal blown by the Germans. So they crossed in assault boats in two places west of Ten Aard and made their way into the village. 44th Lowland needed to establish a bridgehead in Ten Aard from which to breakout and work on the left flank of XXX Corps during "Garden". Ten Aard was in fact to be their launch pad for Market Garden. But Ten Aard was well defended and 8RS took a hammering taking massive casualties. The Germans had zeroed their artillery onto the canal and so any attempt to move food and ammunition across was difficult. They went 4 days without food. The Germans ambushed 6KOSB crossing the canal to the east and forced the battalion to retreat which made things even harder for 8RS. It was dire and so 6RSF were called from reserve but because of flooding only arrived at lunchtime on 15th. After a quick success they too were pushed back. By 17th 15th Division command abandoned Ten Aard and decided to cross the canal some miles to the east. Many good men lost their lives and many queried why 8RS and the other Scots were set up to fail. But the Scots fought with courage and tenacity. After that 8RS moved west of Sint Odenrode to protect XXX Corps left flank. I now live in the Netherlands and have visited all the 44th Lowland battle sites in the country, Ten Aard (x3) in Belgium and a number of places where fighting took place under Veritable, Plunder.....my mum's husband (6RSF) crossed the Rhine on 24 March 1945 alongside 8RS to take the town of Bislich which I have visited many times. He was mortally wounded in that action and is buried in the Netherlands. If you want to follow 8RS I would recommend Martin's book: "The 15th Scottish Division".
I attach a couple of photos. One with the flour mill - 8RS established an OP on the roof which proved invaluable. You can also see the destroyed bridge that 8RS had hoped to cross. Dotted around Ten Aard are buildings which still bear the marks of fighting - it was street fighting and often hand-to-hand.
Good luck with your research.
Cheers
Keith

 

Hi Paula, two men from 6RSF (my mum's husband's battalion) were killed on 13th as 6RSF was getting ready to leave Geel to move northwards to Ten Aard. If I were you I would suggest Googling 15th Scottish Division War Diaries. Its easy to find your way around and if you go to 6RSF you will see a day-by-day account.
Cheers
Keith

 

Hi Paula, have just replied to another of your posts with a suggested web site which I think will get you up and running. Sorry but I misread the dates. On 13th only one was killed in action so that must have been your uncle. It looks like your uncle was D.Coy which helps a lot as the war diaries make reference to the different companies - not all companies were in exactly the same place at the same time.
Good luck.
Keith

 

Hi again Paula, if you look at 6RSF war diaries for 13th you will see a reference to a cross roads that day. If you go to Google maps just outside of Geel the N126 and N102 roads intersect. I checked the grid reference in the war diary and that is bang on that cross roads.
Cheers
Keith

 

Hi Keith, thank you. I've got the war diaries for 6RSF and the reference to the 2 deaths. Can you explain the reference to the crossroads? Is that where you think he was killed?

 

CAn you explain the number references on this extract from 6RSF diary, Keith?