89 CW Coy RE

Hi,
I am looking for help/guidance. One of the things on my fathers "bucket list" is to establish where his father landed on D Day and what his father did.

The enigma is that all the documents/letters/photos/maps that have been passed down all refer to him being in 89th RE but MoD can not pin point any records specific to the 89. What has been confirmed from MoD and the RE Association is the below:-
Richard Sidney Snelgrove 2133350 Sapr - 148 Field Park Sqdn RE posted to:-
11th (CW) TB RE - 12.12.40
89 CW Coy RE - 12.4.41
90 Field Coy RE - 1.7.45
148 Field Park Sqn 28.3.46

My Grandfather apparently did not speak much at all of the war and all we have is that he might of been with some of the first on the beaches to clear them but do not really know. The photos of bridges Nijmegen etc and maps we have do seem to me follow 148 Pk possible landing La Riviere Gold Beach and part of XXX corp as can be seen in a RE Association letter.

Everything I have can be found at Richard Snelgrove 1910 & Emily Symonns 1911 if it helps. He also kept an article about the "Fouled Anchor" and marked specific paragraphs as he did if involved. Who were the fouled anchor?

Any help on where to go the 89 RE, which Commanders diary should I look for etc to confirm the landing place or info on the above would be gratefully received I can only guess or piece things together.

Would like to take my father to the landing beach if possible.

Many Thanks

Mal

 

Here's the war diary ref that is held at the National Archives in London covering all of 1944.

WO 171/1537 89 Company, RE 1944 Jan.- Dec.

 

Almost certainly - Files and poorly named by the NA staff.

 

Thanks Guys for the fast reply's, Being a complete novice I am trying to catch up on posts so as to maximise this forum and not waste anyones time.

I guess the diary WO 171/1537 should give me the relevant info to start with landing and immediate activity?

Mal

 

You never know whats in a diary until its ordered and looked at or copied. They vary greatly-Some are very thin and contain next to know info and some are uber thick and contain a wealth of info.

 

Hi,
The file number that Drew gave does have some information about the unit when it landed in Normandy.

Unfortunately I did not copy it but made a note saying that it had “basic information on the landings”.

The “Fouled Anchor” is the formation sign of the Beach Groups. 89 Company was part of 104 Beach Sub Area (9 and 10 Beach Groups).

Danny

 

Thanks Danny,

Looks like the diary would be a great place to start, thanks for the info on the "Fouled Anchor" starts to help piece together why G'Dad kept the paper article from the time marking relevant paragraphs about what they were involved in. he never said but just kept certain photos/maps etc with markings on.

Cheers
Malcolm

 

Hi Malcolm,

Ive looked through his service and can only find the two diaries listed above-Oddly nothing on 89 Coy pre 1944, 90 Coy and 148 Sqn that I can find.

Drop me a PM if you want either of the two diaries copying.

Cheers
Andy

 

Thanks Andy,

Interesting looking like it might be fun tracking him down..Does anything show for the 11th or 148 sqn - pre 44, wonder if the date 1941 is wrong and he was with 11th or 148 pre 44? I'll PM you on th diaries.

Thanks
Malcolm

 

I've found these catalogue numbers for 89 Coy RE.
Wondering if that is same as 89 CW Coy RE ?

ROYAL ENGINEERS
WO 171/1537
89 Coy.
Covering dates 1944 Jan.- Dec

WO 171/5451
89 Coy.
Covering dates 1945 Jan.- July

The 89 CW Coy, RE, stands for '89th Chemical Warfare Company, RE.' I don't believe this is the same as the 89th Field Company, RE.

The latter landed through King Sector of Gold Beach, with 69th - 5th Bn East Yorkshire Regt, and 6th & 7th Bns Green Howards - and 151st Infantry Brigade - 6th, 8th & 9th Bns Durham Light Infantry, both of 50th (Northumbrian) Division, on D-Day. Landing table link here:

http://www.6juin1944.com/assaut/gold/en_page.php?page=69landing

The 89 CW Coy, RE, was part of the 8th GHQ Troops, RE, along with the 90th & 91st CW Coys, RE, from circa 1943.

I'll do a bit of digging to see what I can find out about the latter!

Best,

Steve.

 

Found another source which states that 89th Chemical Warfare Company, RE, became 89th Field Company, RE, and was deployed on D-Day per Danny's post at Message #7; link:

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:5ggxq_P9V-YJrbat.com/site/uk_orbats/files/6/RE%2520World%2520War%2520II.pdf+89th+Chemical+Warfare+Company,+RE&hl=en&gl=uk&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESiiDm__hsscw0wooXLv5kFoettGn31VmyPXBcmkEwnxteVY1tgPEfgC9ueaBT6gh2NyR3V1OqXet0ToXV5afyemc-5l7eTUXMMAEa2qaAjiYQAf_T-ATX-vBK61qlwkPCiiUzSb&sig=AHIEtbQjIjK11WJdZN-W5dd49omxK_hzjA

"...89th Chem Warfare Coy RE 1940 (assigned 8th Chem Warfare Group RE). Converted 1943... as 89 Field Coy RE (and group reorganized as 8th GHQTRE) [Normandy landing (104 Beach Sub-Area)]. Disbanded Sep 1945+."

The landing table for 89th Field Company, RE, detailed in my previous post at Message #11 is relevant.

Best,

Steve.

 

Thanks Steve,

Great information and great website details, apologies for my naivety but could you tell me what the "H" means under ready to beach and what the Carrier U Kapoked was. Google does not show anything. Seeing the craft type is great as the family have always been intrigued about Granddads landing and on what type of boat as he could not swim but we believe did not tell anyone!

Also this might be an open question but is there some where or link that would confirm he was on board and what sort of time they were due to land etc... 1st/2nd wave...

Cheers
Malcolm

 

Hello Malcolm,

The landing on Gold Beach was scheduled for 7.25am, 6 June 1944. This was 'H' Hour.

In King Sector, the 69th Infantry Brigade, 50th (Northumbrian) Division, was in the first wave and it looks like two vehicles with men of the 89th Field Coy, RE, landed at H-Hour. However, most of the 89th Field Coy, RE, appear to have landed between H+45 and H+90 i.e. between 45 and 90 minutes after H-Hour. Some landed still later at H+120. It appears the vast majority of the 89th Field Coy, RE, landed in the first wave between 7.25am and 9.25am.

However, just over 50 men of the 89th Field Coy, RE, landed in the second wave with the 6th Bn Durham Light Infantry, 151st Infantry Brigade, 50th (Northumbrian) Division, at H+2.5 i.e. two and a half hours after H-Hour, or 9.55am.

NB. The 151st Infantry Brigade, 50th (Northumbrian) Division, had been in the first wave in the landings at Avola, Sicily, on 10 March 1943 - Operation Husky - and so were relieved from landing first this time.

Regarding whether there somewhere or a link that would confirm that your granddad was on board and what sort of time they were due to land etc.? That's a difficult ask! You may get that information from War Diaries, but that is not at all certain. Probably the RE Association and/or Museum would be your best bet; links here:

http://www.reahq.org.uk/

http://www.re-museum.co.uk/

-If they don't know they should be able to point you in the right direction.

A 'Carrier U' is probably a Universal Carrier, or Bren Carrier as it was more commonly known. I've only seen the word 'kapoked' used as slang for borrowed or stolen. Could it have been a borrowed Bren Carrier?

I hope this is helpful.

Best,

Steve.

 

Hi Steve,

Many thanks again extremely informative, you clearly have put a lot of research in. This helps a lot and fits in with a snippet from my Dad that he thought he was 45 mins behind the first team. Drew is going to copy the two diaries for me so we can see what they hold, I can then start to build a picture hopefully of 1944/first half 45 before looking at pre and post these dates.

Does not appear to be too much about 89 Coy that is easily accessible or maybe not many people started to ask as yet.

Many Thanks Again
Cheers
Malcolm

 

Hello Malcom,

You find that there is a lot of information about the main Infantry ballalions and not a lot about Divisional troops - which 89th Field Coy, RE were, as they were attched to 50 Div for the purpose of the landings.

You can narrow down your search by looking at the Landing Table, under 69th Infantry Brigade, then H+45, then 89 Fd Coy; which will give you the Landing Craft number and various details of the disembarkations therefrom.

Its good that you have got Andy (Drew) involved with the War Diaries - good service, which I have used myself. But unless your granddad was an Officer he may not get a mention. You should consider speaking to the RE Association or Museum in the meantime.

Best of luck with your search.

Steve.

 

Thanks Steve,

Your info has been great and I now fully understand the Landing Table! which has been helpful. I hope the diaries will expand in more detail but even if they give an outline of his activities that would be far more than we have today. In fact this forum just in the last couple of days has confirmed and given us greater detail than the MoD or REA could 24yrs ago when my father last tried. So thanks.

I am looking forward to the journey he was one of four brothers who served each in different areas and all came back and yet we know so little. Hope to trace the other three brothers in good time but I have one photo of all of them and just names and hats to look at with possibilities of who they were with ie RAF/RA/RTC-CME.

I'll let you know how we get on.

Cheers
Malcolm

 

Hello Malcolm,

The 50th (Northumbrian) Division is my historical hobby, because of family connections and I am very interested in your journey of discovery - both, to hopefully help you - that's the main aim - and to learn more myself; and then I can help others more...

This is a wonderful forum and there are lots of people who can assist you, but the one man I think would be invaluable to you and able to help you with specific insights based on personal experience about the RE on D-Day is a veteran - Brian Guy (handle 'Sapper'). Unfortunately, Brian has not visited the forum for a couple of months - a great loss.

Brian landed with the 3rd Infantry Division on Sword Beach and fought through to The Netherlands where he was severely injured.

Please consider sending Brian a PM - personal message - about your journey of discovery and I hope - fingers crossed - that he will respond.

Here's hoping!

Regardless, please do let me/the forum know how you are getting on and do post again if you need any assistance/information.

Best,

Steve.