2nd Ox & Bucks soldier (Help Required)

Discussion in 'Searching for Someone & Military Genealogy' started by J_Hall, Feb 8, 2010.

  1. J_Hall

    J_Hall Junior Member

    Hi all,
    I'm trying to find out what my grandad -Cecil Joseph Hall (Joe)- did in the war, but I only have a few pieces of info to go on:

    1) His pay-book says he was in the 2nd Ox & Bucks Light Infantry. But I think he moved over to this unit as he was in the Leicester regiment for a while beforehand.

    2)He talked about landing in gliders and being in Belgium, Germany, Egypt, and Palestine (where he was stationed immediately after the war was over).

    3) He also mentioned being involved in a bayonet charge, and the only thing I can find about that is the taking of Hamminkeln bridge during Operation Varsity. That was in Wikipedia though so i'm dubious about it's accuracy.

    If anyone could help flesh this out a bit or throw in a few facts they know of i'd be very appreciative.

    Many thanks
    Joe
     
  2. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

  3. J_Hall

    J_Hall Junior Member

    Hi CL1, and thanks.

    The problem with getting his service record is that i'd need proof of power of attorney or his written consent. I don't have the former and unfortunately my grandad, whilst still alive, has dementia and so unable to give the consent. Would this stop me from recieving any info if I did send off for it?
    Thanks
     
  4. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    Joe
    it might be worth you giving the service records office a call,they could possibly shed some more light on the situation.
     
  5. GPRegt

    GPRegt Senior Member

    Joe,

    Welcome to the Forum.

    The bayonet story is true. It was led by your Grandad's Platoon Leader, Lt Hugh Clark MC. The Platoon was No 19/D Company.

    Steve W.
     
  6. englandphil

    englandphil Very Senior Member

  7. J_Hall

    J_Hall Junior Member

    Thanks Phil, very interesting site, i've just had a good read of it. It seems to cover only the Normandy campaign and on looking at the roll-call list his name is not there.

    I wasn't sure he was on the D-Day drop to be honest, and given that he mentioned Belgium I think he may have come into the Ox & Bucks after they'd returned to England as a replacement for all the casualties.

    ------

    Thanks GPRegT, he mentioned very little about the war but when his dementia set in he seemed to have flashbacks and spoke to my aunt about bayonetting a German in such detail it made her ill!
    I've looked all over for the bayonet charge but can't find anything about it. Do you have anymore info in it?

    Thanks again,
    Joe
     
  8. James Daly

    James Daly Senior Member

    I wasn't sure he was on the D-Day drop to be honest, and given that he mentioned Belgium I think he may have come into the Ox & Bucks after they'd returned to England as a replacement for all the casualties.



    The Belgium part could be the Ardennes. I seem to recall that 6th Airborne were among the British units brought in as reinforcements, although I'm not sure exactly where they were during the Battle of the Bulge.
     
  9. wtid45

    wtid45 Very Senior Member

    The 2ND Ox&Bucks as part of 6th Airborne were rushed to The Ardennes after the German offensive of 16 December 44 and stayed until 24 January, during this time one of its companies supported 13 Para in heavy fighting in the village of Bure.
     
  10. 52nd Airborne

    52nd Airborne Green Jacket Brat

    during this time one of its companies supported 13 Para in heavy fighting in the village of Bure.

    C Company, lead by Major John Granville.
     
    wtid45 likes this.
  11. 52nd Airborne

    52nd Airborne Green Jacket Brat

    Joe,

    Welcome to the Forum.

    The bayonet story is true. It was led by your Grandad's Platoon Leader, Lt Hugh Clark MC. The Platoon was No 19/D Company.

    Steve W.

    Steve,

    19 Platoon was in B company at the time of Op Varsity and as you quite rightly say it was led by Lt R H Clark. Lt Clark was awarded the MC for leading the charge to recapture the bridge.
     
  12. J_Hall

    J_Hall Junior Member

    Thanks for the info everyone, very interesting indeed.

    At the moment i'm trying to find out when he joined the Ox & Bucks and what he did before that. He mentioned that he was in the Leicestershire Regiment, but that on returning from leave they had been sent to Australia without him. I can't find any information on this though, so does anyone know what the Leicestershire Regiment did before goin to Oz? He said he was in Egypt but whether that was with the Leicesters or the Ox & Bucks I don't know.

    Thanks
    Joe

    PS. I can get ahold of his army number if that's any help to anyone?
     
  13. 52nd Airborne

    52nd Airborne Green Jacket Brat

  14. J_Hall

    J_Hall Junior Member

    Thanks 52nd Airborne, I've had a look and his number comes up us being (initially) that of General Service Corps (14200001 - 15000000) - My Grandad's number being 14223695.

    Anybody know what the General Service Corps is? He mentioned being in the artillery for a while too so could this be it?

    I would have thought that being from Leicester and serving in the Leicestershire Regiment (He has a cap badge of this with "Hindoostan" on it) his number would correspond with the Leicestershire Regiment numbers.

    I have a photo of him in what is presumably desert kit (shorts etc) holding a sten gun, would it be worth posting it on here so anyone able to ident the uniform/badges etc could maybe see it?
     
  15. wtid45

    wtid45 Very Senior Member

    A lot of soldiers were intially put into the General Service Corps it only came into being in 1943, it was a holding unit for officers and specialists primarally reservists. Thus they carried that number throughout thier army service regardless of Regiment change, hence the number not matching the Leicesters.
     
  16. J_Hall

    J_Hall Junior Member

    Well thats interesting, the General Service Corps only came into being in 1943 when my grandad would have been 19/20. He wasn't an officer or specialist (he was a greengrocer's assistant beforehand). I was under the assumption that he was called-up at 18.

    To add more confusion to what he did and where he went he also said he was in the artillery (which accounts for his bad hearing), and was very proud of bein in the Green Howards too.
     
  17. wtid45

    wtid45 Very Senior Member

    Im getting confused Leicesters, OX&Bucks, Royal Artillery Green Howards and General Service Corps!:confused:
     
  18. J_Hall

    J_Hall Junior Member

    Me too! Here's what I know for sure...

    General Service Corps - His army number matches the GSC number range

    Leicestershire Regiment - He's from Leicester and has Leicester's "Hindoostan" cap-badge. His friend Bill was also in the Leicesters and it was through him that he met my grandmother.

    2nd Ox & Bucks - It's in his discharge papers.


    All I know about the rest was stories that he was in the artillery for a time which resulted in very bad hearing later in life, and his telling my grandmother that he was very proud of being in the Green Howards.

    Is it usual to move around so much? I know he had no choice in leaving the Leicesters as he returned from leave to find them all gone and en-route to Australia to defend against the Japanese threat. I assume it's from here that he went to the Ox & Bucks or the Howards.
     
  19. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    My Dad's Service record (14536215) shows him joining B.Coy 18 PTC G.S.C. in February 1943. He then went on to 3. Sig Trg. Centre for Signals training. Although his record does not show it, I believe he was badged as Sherwood Forresters for a time and the battalion that he left was badly mauled at Anzio.

    Coincidentally, his elder brother Sid was Royal Artillery (AA I believe) in the UK for most of the war but was transferred to Ox & Bucks LI in time for the Rhine Crossing.

    I should ask Dad about applying for the service records.
     
  20. wtid45

    wtid45 Very Senior Member

    I think we need to establish some dates you say you have a record of his discharge, and I have been finding conflicting dates over what I said about the GSC one says it came into being in Feb 42, but I have found ref to it in WW1:unsure:
     

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