Searching for information, or how to get information on RAF Flying Officer

My Grandfather joined the RAF or more likely the Volunteer Reserve in 1942, was sent to Southern Rhodesia to Train at Guinea Fowl RAF base.

From there, I have no idea on what Squadron he was in, or where he fought, how would I get these Details.

Service Number 186269 (Indicated previous service as 1800857, not sure how this is possible as he joined straight from School, this may be a Volunteer Reserve number, and Second number is RAF number during WW2)

I do know that he was promoted to Pilot Officer, and then to Flying Officer.

In 1946 he relocated to Southern Rhodesia, and served in the Special Duties Branch of the RAF Volunteer Reserve (It indicates a rank of Flying Officer with seniority, although I am not sure such a thing exists.) at RAF Kumalo until 1948 on a full time basis, before remaining in the reserve until 1959 where it says that he relinquished his commission, however retaining his rank. I am not 100% what all of this means.

There is a book written which includes his name, and some of his crew, with a photo of them in front of their Lancaster. This book seems to indicate that they joined 7 Squadron Path Finders Group as part of No.8 Bomber Command.

 

Depending on if he is alive, passed away and how long dead will alter what comes back but the only method to get full posting detal is to apply for his service record from RAF Disclosures.
Request records of deceased service personnel

Use the online method and in the extra information box ask for informal review of mustering for release.

Not sure where you got the service number/[personal number from but 186269 related to H C Wilson RFC WWI history and would not be consistent with Lancaster and post war A&SD branch service. (Duff info ignore - see later posts by Owen and myself)

Ross

 

Mike welcome to the forum

if you shared his name forum and any documents you have members might be able to help further but as Ross suggests the only way to go is service records

regards
Clive

 

Well spotted Owen.

To my shame I had side tracked myself to associating the later Euston issued OR service number to previous OR service and not subsequent Commissioned Personal Number.

Page 4
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/36823/data.pdf

Confirms his commission with new Personal Number in 1944 with previous OR Service Number for his ACH/Sgt/FSgt service

Ross

 

These are the correct records him. Cecil Edward Proome.

He died in South Africa in 1990. Was born in England in 1923.

I have requested the RAF records from online. Was just wondering if anyone had any other places that may have info.

Or anyway to find info of what they did in Reserves in Southern Rhodesia after the war

 

He appears to have flown with No. 90 and No. 7 Squadron, with postings as follows:

01/12/1944 To 90 Squadron
27/02/1945 From 90 Squadron to 7 Squadron
28/03/1945 From 7 Squadron to 90 Squadron (last op recorded 16/05/1945)

No details before, or after these dates

 

Thank you very much for these details. I really appreciate it. Now I at least have a bit more information to do some searching with.

I think it will be incredibly difficult to find any information of what happened after he returned to Southern Rhodesia after the war with the RAF. He was still in permanent service according to his service book until 1948. And 1 record I have shows he only relinquished the commission mentioned above in July of 1959, but retained his rank after he relinquished his commission.

 

"in 1946 he relocated to Southern Rhodesia, and served in the Special Duties Branch of the RAF Volunteer Reserve (It indicates a rank of Flying Officer with seniority, although I am not sure such a thing exists.) at RAF Kumalo until 1948 on a full time basis, before remaining in the reserve until 1959 where it says that he relinquished his commission, however retaining his rank. I am not 100% what all of this means."

Not sure that you understand this section fully.

He transferred from RAFVR General Duties Branch to RAFVR Admin & Special Duties 18 July 1946 the seniority part means he retained the authority of his rank from when he gained it in the previous branch rather than it afresh with the new branch. Hence in 1948 (on the reconstitution of RAFVR 1947 - reorganisation) he is appointed substansive F/O with seniority from 14th Oct 1945.

General Duties Branch was typically flying, stores, engineering etc until specifically broken out to new Branches. A&SD was not cloak and dagger but mostly for administration duties eg Clerk, Registry and was considered as a continuation for officers who could contribute to the running of units but were unlikely to be advancing to AIR or higher rank in active flying roles. The second in command Adjudant was almost always A&SD Branch due to need to admininster the Confidential Books and Files.

On transfer to the reserve he would have ceased to actively service just an obligation for a period (usually 5 years) to return to active service if recalled - he may have taken annual refresher but usually not for A&SD Branch.

On retirement the Air Council could grant permission for a civilian to use former rank as part of their title - this is the bit about retaining rank - it's title only.

Ross

 

Hi Ross. Thank you very much.

Your knowledge is awesome, thank you for sharing it.

From what my Grandmother told me, at the end of WW2, with the Air Force reducing numbers and the UK government trying to get people to return to work, he had very few options.

He obviously went straight from school into air force training, so knew nothing else. But was told there was no permanent positions in the RAF in the UK.

At the same time the UK was trying to reinforce their colonies.

He was now obviously back in the Volunteer Reserve. And was given the options of moving to India, Hong Kong or Southern Rhodesia.

Due to him having been in Southern Rhodesia for training, that's where he decided to go. My Gran followed about 3 months later after the birth of their son, on troop ship via Suez Canal to Durban.

So glad that I now know a little of his service.

I am going through some old things. Will post if I find anything relating to Service

 

There are a number of books on the Royal Rhodesian Air Force (RRAF), their focus is not on the personnel serving and most focus on the conflict after 1965.

For an online brief history try: History of The Rhodesian Air Force and a wider personal story: http://researchdata.uwe.ac.uk/104/170/roh-oh-cha-to-appr.pdf Then this: The Rhodesian Air Force which was found via searching RRAF in full plus your subject's surname. It has a small number of B&W photos, which I have not looked through.

A longer one (pub. 2013): Our Rhodesian Heritage: A Pride of Eagles (Supplement)

 

See also
Beryl Salt
Pride of Eagles: A history of the Rhodesian Air Force
Helion/30 South, 2nd Edn 2015 759pp, illus, pb.
Foreword: A/M AOG Wilson ICD OBE DFC(US) RhAF (retd)
Fully indexed, sadly no mention of F/O Proome.
Rhodesian Air Force from beginning to 1980 end.

Copies new at fair prices from 30 pounds odd on amazon.co.uk and
new by POD in Australia eg at amazon.com.au

Many listed copies on bookfinder.com, again at prices from 30 pounds odd (new & 2nd hand) to frankly exorbitant (2nd Hand).

No copies of Beverly Whyte A pride of eagles found per Amazon, Book Depository or bookfinder presently.

Not mentioned in brief Salt Biblio or Author's notes, where Ms Salt remarks:
"I was asked by Wing Commander Len Pink to write this official history"
and
"This is not the story of seven years of Bush War. It is the narrative of a fighting force..."

 

Our Rhodesian Heritage: A Pride of Eagles (Supplement)

I have a copy of Beryl Salt's "A Pride of Eagles - The Definitive History of the Rhodesian Air Force 1920 - 1980" which must be the first edition (2001). The price tag was huge and is, still, the only book I own which ever arrived in its own Royal Mail bag. 1000 pgs and a different cover. Ignore the "weight 5.6 oz". They meant pounds.

Unfortunately F/O Proome doesn't appear in the index.

Regards,

Dave

 

Mike I'm sure you know this, but just in case - the squadron Operation Record Books are available free from The National Archives; for bomber squadrons they will typically contain crews by name and operation, so it is often possible to track a man's operational career op by op, though there's not always a lot of detail.

Cheers, Pat

 

Mike,

Have you tried the RAF Museum Library, to see if they have any books you need? I assume there is one.

Second option, would be use Worldcat: WorldCat.org: The World's Largest Library Catalog which is a global library catalogue and you can search by distance from you.

 

Thanks very much Dave.

This book is more likely to feature my Uncle Marcus who worked in the Rhodesian Air Force rather than my Grand father. I know he is still friends, and attends gatherings with people from his old air force days.

 

Thanks very much. Yes, I am aware of this, however, have not had the time to start downloading, or reading through any of the ones available for download. This is next on my To Do list.

I have also requested his service records from RAF, however, I require his Death Certificate, which is easier said than done. All I have at the moment is the Gazette from South Africa publishing his death, but this was not accepted by the RAF.

 

Thank you for this

 

As it happens I have the Forms 540 & 541 for 90 Sqdn, December 1944, so I took a quick look - P/O Proome and his crew appear to have undertaken their first op on the night of 15th December against Siegen; however, the 90 Sqdn aircraft were recalled before they reached the target.

All the best with your research.