British Vehicle Markings - a rough guide

Discussion in 'Weapons, Technology & Equipment' started by SquireBev, May 30, 2020.

  1. gmyles

    gmyles Senior Member

    I have a question.

    When Brigades operated independently or out of the normal Divisional Structure like 23rd Armoured Brigade Group and 2nd Independent Parachute Brigade Group did in Greece, did they adopt AOS of the senior Brigade?

    It looks like 23rd Armoured Brigade Group did as this image below matches all of the photos I have seen of their tanks.

    upload_2021-2-8_10-48-14.png

    Haven't yet found a single pic of a vehicle from 2nd Independent Parachute Brigade Group to test my theory yet.

    There were also only 24 tanks in Greece when the civil war started arriving on two separate ships in November 1944. Where should I be looking for a detailed list of the tanks ID numbers and whether they arrived on the first or second shipment?

    Regards

    Gus
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2021
  2. Christian Fletcher

    Christian Fletcher Well-Known Member

    Will be very interested in what you can discover! I think the basic AoS markings are correct but what about the rest of the Group.
    At least until Feb 45 these units were under command:
    463 Bty 104 RHA
    1238 Fd Coy RE
    331 & 333 Transport Coys RASC
    150 Lt Fd Ambulance.

    Some of these AoS numbers are known for NW Europe but not for Italy/Greece. That I know of! Hopefully somebody knows differently! Cheers
     
  3. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    It's been a bit of a nightmare to collate, but here's my first attempt at a timeline for the North African campaign.

    Feedback and corrections welcome as ever.

    If anyone can shed any more light on the 4th and 7th Armoured Brigades in 1940-41 I'd be very grateful, as I'm sure the 7th and 8th Hussars couldn't be in two places at once!

    Apologies for the enormous image size. You might have to open them in a new tab to view them properly.

    Middle East - Armoured Divisions

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  4. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    I love the fact this rough guide is now at 200+ posts.

    'I know, lets get Allied military markings in order, It can't be that byzantine/complex, can it?!'
    'Oh...'

    Great stuff, and I really like the website.
     
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  5. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    And I haven't even started on the Far East yet!

    Thank you. Glad it's proven interesting.
     
  6. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    This weighty tome came in the post yesterday. Hopefully it'll help iron out a few inconsistencies in the timeline.

    20210428_210815.jpg
     
  7. Christian Fletcher

    Christian Fletcher Well-Known Member

    Presumably Joslen? Very good indeed though it has its limitations and some inconsistencies! How he and his team even managed to put it together in the time that they had using only paper trails (some of which had been broken not once but several times!) I don't know. Even with computers this would have been a real beast! So all hail Lieut-Colonel Joslen!
     
  8. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Yes indeed. Seems to be the first edition too so any errors won't have been corrected, but it's still a fantastic resource.

    I should have Volume II on the way too. Hoping it's just been delayed in the post...
     
    Christian Fletcher likes this.
  9. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Looks like Volume II of Joslen isn't coming, sadly. Turns out the listing was incorrect, and they've offered to refund me. Oh well.

    In the meantime I've been using Volume I to start on an overall timeline of armoured divisions and brigades, showing composition, seniority, commanders, and theatre.

    Screenshot_20210503-205455_Drive.jpg
     
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  10. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Reckon I can include the AoS serials too...

    ADTimelineExample.png
     
  11. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Big News!

    While I continue to work on the timeline diagrams, I've decided to move the site to a new home and a new host, so that I'll be able to upload PDF versions of the various diagrams, hopefully allowing them to be more easily read.

    Please update your bookmarks!

    http://www.uk-tank-markings.co.uk/
     
  12. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Aixman and Chris C like this.
  13. Beautiful chart as always!

    I hope you will keep the charts posted in your website in their image versions as well, because I find pdf much less pleasant and easy to handle.

    Note that 4 Armd Bde flash was not Red but Green over Blue. See:
    Arm of Service Marking Dilemma.

    Michel
     
  14. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Thank you Michel. I've heard rumours of this blue/green flash but this is the first evidence I've seen. I'll have a proper look into it and update accordingly.

    And yes, I'll be publishing both PNG and PDF versions. Wordpress doesn't shrink and compress images like Blogger does, so they should stay in their HD glory.
     
  15. Chris WIlletts

    Chris WIlletts Active Member

    Hi Squire, Do you have any information on Truck markings? I am doing research/diorama building with my Nana on my late Grandfather Stanley Coleman who served with 7th Green Howards as a truck driver. This is his thread on ww2talk 7th Bn Green Howards - Stanley Coleman - Hartlepool
     
  16. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    My knowledge of BEF markings isn't as good as I'd like it to be, but I'll have a read of the thread and see what I can come up with.
     
  17. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Just a quick one. I've updated the Independent Armoured Brigade diagrams to reflect the new information about the 4th Armoured Brigade's markings, and some new information that has also come to light regarding the 33rd.

    Updates – 12/05/21
     
  18. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Another quick one.

    I've updated the 79th Armoured Division timeline to offer a slightly more accurate picture of unit movements.

    Updates – 19/05/21

    [​IMG]

    Edit: Just spotted a couple of "overlaps". Standby for a corrected version!
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2021
    Aixman likes this.
  19. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

  20. SquireBev

    SquireBev Well-Known Member

    Good news! I've finally got my hands on a copy of the expanded edition of Hodges and Taylor. It contains a LOT of extra information, especially covering North Africa and Italy.

    Once I've finished the OOB visual timeline I should be able to make quite a few updates to the Division and Corps AoS diagrams.

    Stay tuned!
     

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