War Diaries - 14 Training Battalion RASC

Discussion in 'RASC' started by James Carver, Jul 10, 2019.

  1. James Carver

    James Carver Member

    Hi,

    I am researching my great grandfather (Lieutenant Frederick Horace Chinn) who was in the RASC. I got a copy of his Military Records and it states he was dismissed from service by a General Court Martial.

    He had served in Palestine, Africa, France, Greece, Egypt and the UK.

    Before he was court martialled, his Records say he was a lieutenant in what looks to be the 14th Training Battalion linked to the RASC. Does anyone know the archives reference for this units war diaries for around 1943/1944.

    Any information would be appreciated,
    Thanks,
    James Carver
     
  2. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    I've had a look at Discovery, the National Archives search engine, but nothing obvious is coming up (using all the standard abbreviations).

    I'd suggest that you upload photographs of the service records; we might be able to glean some further clues.
     
  3. James Carver

    James Carver Member

    Ok, I will try to later. Thanks James Carver
     
  4. James Carver

    James Carver Member

    This is the file relating to his final bits of service. The full WW2 Information is too large for upload.

    James Carver
     

    Attached Files:

    • 427.pdf
      File size:
      1.9 MB
      Views:
      9
  5. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    I see the location given for 14 Training Battalion is Southend-on-Sea.

    From this entry:
    RASC Officers Training School | The National Archives

    I see note also that the RASC Officers Training School was located in Southend, but I can find no diaries or documentation for any unit or institution there.

    The only one that comes close is this:

    Reference: WO 166/12790
    Description: C.R.A.S.C. Combined Trg Centre
    Date: 1943 Jan.-Mar.

    Which is very unlikely to hold material of interest to you.

    I assume you have checked the two sections of the Army Act (1 x Section 16; 3 x Section 41) mentioned and have a (very broad) idea of why he was court-martialled?

    I doubt it will have any additional detail, but the London Gazette announcement (6/6/44) cited might also be worth finding.

    Whatever is at the bottom of all this is going to be a sad story, it seems.

    The note 'no grounds for restoration' on the first page suggests to me that the Court Martial stripped him of his awards.
     
  6. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    London Gazette unrevealing:

    1942:
    Screenshot 2019-07-11 at 02.08.58.png

    1944:
    Screenshot 2019-07-11 at 02.07.56.png
     
  7. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    Is this the man

    Frederick Horace Chinn
    1896–1968
    BIRTH 05 AUG 1896 • Peckham, Surrey, England
    DEATH 29 NOV 1968 • Southend on Sea, Essex, England
    [​IMG]

    TD
     
  8. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

  9. James Carver

    James Carver Member

    Hello Charley,

    Would that note just relate to the medals he was awarded for action in WW2 or would it also apply to his 2 medals awarded in WW1?

    Thanks,
    James Carver
     
  10. James Carver

    James Carver Member

    Yes, it might have been off of my ancestry account?
     
  11. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    You have uploaded more than you think you have [in fact there are 11 sheets] - page 3 of your upload shows

    upload_2019-7-10_19-52-37.png

    Not very well copied here but it explains about his court martial in Colchester - can you upload a much better image

    TD
     
  12. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

  13. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

  14. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Sorry, I don't know.
     
  15. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    upload_2019-7-10_19-58-59.png

    I read the top line as saying
    "Awards earned before dismissal from His Majestys Service"
    Odd that its date stamped May 1996

    TD
     
  16. James Carver

    James Carver Member

    Yes I thought this odd as well. I have been able to read the words on page 11. It is where I first found out about the court martial and the information on it has allowed me to find limited facts at the archives but no full information. I did find that he was charged with 2 accounts of fraud and 1 account of behaving in a manner not suitable for an officer or a gentleman.

    Thanks,
    James Carver
     
  17. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Did another family member apply for records or medals in 1996?
     
  18. James Carver

    James Carver Member

    My Grandmother (his daughter) requested his records around that time, but not medals. Got 2 page summery back from MOD and no mention of court martial. That is why I re-requested them asking for all documents.
     
  19. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    My guess is that her application prompted a review and that note.

    I am conscious that this is potentially sensitive ground, but has your genealogical work shown whether he and your great-grandmother formally divorced and/or whether he later remarried or fathered more children?

    I wonder if there could be other people with more information.
     
  20. James Carver

    James Carver Member

    Officially, he was not married to my great grandmother, we believe they were is a common law marriage. He had a first wife who he did not get on with but could not divorce as they were married in the Catholic church no children from first marriage.

    Did not have any more children after my grandmother and great uncle they have little information as we think he was arrested when they were young and my great grandmother never spoke of him.

    James
     

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