Tracing grandad Joe

Discussion in 'Searching for Someone & Military Genealogy' started by Joe tonks, Jun 2, 2018.

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  1. Joe tonks

    Joe tonks Member

    hello

    I'm trying to find any information about my great grand father.
    His name was Joseph Tonks.
    Army number 320423.
    He was killed on the 3rd of September 1944 and is buried at gradara war cemetery in Italy

    Any help with information would be much appreciated and any pointers on where to look gladly received
     
  2. Incredibledisc

    Incredibledisc Well-Known Member

    Hi Joe. This thread might help give you some more information about 2RTR 2 RTR
     
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  3. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    apply for service records is a good start Get a copy of military service records

    SerjeantTONKS, JOSEPH
    Service Number 320423

    Died 03/09/1944

    Aged 24

    2nd
    Royal Tank Regiment, R.A.C.

    Son of John and Florence Tonks, of Oldbury, Birmingham; husband of Mary Ann Tonks, of Oldbury.


    INSCRIPTION
    THE LORD BLESS THEE AND KEEP THEE
    Casualty
     
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  4. Mr Jinks

    Mr Jinks Bit of a Cad

    L/Cpl Joseph Tonks Wounded 27th May 1940 BEF France 10th (PWO) Royal Hussars

    Sgt Joseph Tonks Killed in Action Italy 3rd September 1944 2nd RTR.

    2nd listing with 4 Casualties from 2nd RTR
    3321746 W F Jowers Tpr
    558330 W A Snelson Cpl
    320423 J Tonks Sgt
    7942210 H S Williams Tpr

    Kyle

    GBM_WO417_013_0005a.jpg GBM_WO417_081_0651a.jpg GBM_WO417_082_0127a.jpg
     
  5. Joe tonks

    Joe tonks Member

    First of all thank you

    I had no idea he had been wounded previously.

    Do you know what the hand written numbers are after his name in the third document ?
     
  6. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

  7. Joe tonks

    Joe tonks Member

    My grandad is buried next to those other rtr men in rank order. I'm assuming they could have been crew members as I belive 2rtr were equipped with shermans at that time.
     
  8. timuk

    timuk Well-Known Member

    Joe,
    Have you seen the answers to your question regarding the original burial site posted on another thread? Problems of posting on multiple threads. I think you should ask a Mod to move these posts to this thread so all the info is in one place.
    Tim
     
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  9. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    Joe.

    On 3 Sep 44, 2 RTR were moving from II (PO) Corps to 7 Armd Bde to fill in for 6 RTR who were sent to support the advance of 4 Indian Division on the very left of the V (BR) Corps line. That made me doubt that he was killed on that day. I suspect that he, and his crew, were badly injured whilst supporting the advance of II (PO) Corps in late Aug 44.

    The WD may tell us something.

    Regards

    Frank
     
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  10. Joe tonks

    Joe tonks Member

    So would there have been a notification of injury then death as I beliee there is only a letter saying he was KIA
     
  11. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    Joe.

    His mother may well have received a letter of condolence from Sgt Tonks's Squadron Leader.

    Either way, the most reliable way to find out because it is more likely to have been recorded there, are the War Diaries. To lose a whole crew outside the main set piece battleship is more unusual and so may well have been noted in the WDs.

    Does anybody out there happen to have the 2 RTR WDs for end of Aug/start of Sep 44?

    Regards

    Frank
     
  12. Joe tonks

    Joe tonks Member

    frank

    I've just spoken to a family member who said that he was killed not in direct battle but was having a meeting when they were shelled in some woods. I belive one of his comrades told this to my great grand mother and the story passed down.
     
  13. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    Joe.

    That is much more likely although I suspect that the shelling did not take place on 3 Sep 44 because 2 RTR was quite a long way behind the line doing its move over to 7 Armd Bde.

    Regards

    Frank
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2018
  14. Mr Jinks

    Mr Jinks Bit of a Cad

    This is related but not directly involving Sgt Tonks . In the casualty list I posted under
    2nd listing with 4 Casualties from 2nd RTR ?
    3321746 W F Jowers Tpr
    558330 W A Snelson Cpl
    320423 J Tonks Sgt
    7942210 H S Williams Tpr
    The CWGC have Snelson listed as a Captain but the concentration still states Cpl ?
    Casualty
    There were also three other 2 RTR casualties for this day.
    7907092 Cpl M W H Allen (amended from DoW to KiA)
    7882907 Tpr F A Newton. (amended from DoW to KiA)
    7927218 Tpr R G Parker (Previously wounded in N,Africa 1942)

    Kyle
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2018
  15. Joe tonks

    Joe tonks Member

    I've been reading through the war diaries and it states on the 3/9/44 that 2 ORs ( I assume ordinary ranks ) were killed and 1 officer and 5 OR swerve wounded by heavy mortar and artillery fire from tavaleto but there are no names mentions .
     
  16. Mr Jinks

    Mr Jinks Bit of a Cad

    Perhaps the officer was Snelson ,if the CWGC details are correct then he was a Captain not a Corporal ? I wonder what rank his grave stone records?

    Kyle
     
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  17. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Re member

    UK, Army Roll of Honour, 1939-1945
    Name: William Snelson
    Given Initials: W A
    Rank: Corporal
    Death Date: 3 Sep 1944
    Number: 558330
    Birth Place: Manchester
    Residence: Manchester
    Regiment at Enlistment: 10th Royal Hussars (Prince of Own) RAC
    Branch at Enlistment: Royal Armoured Corps
    Theatre of War: Italy
    Regiment at Death: Royal Tank Regiment RAC
    Branch at Death: Royal Armoured Corps

    TD
     
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  18. timuk

    timuk Well-Known Member

    Headstone documentation attached to William Snelson entry on CWGC also indicates rank of Corporal. I'll contact CWGC.

    Tim
     
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  19. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Re member

    [​IMG]

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    TD
     
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  20. timuk

    timuk Well-Known Member

    Deleted

    Tim
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2018

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