Tigers in the Ardennes.

Fantastic Site Adam and the information is really interesting. Found the journey of KG Peiper to be the highlight of the site!

 

Looking for some caption info for gallery photos I came across this excellent site on sSSPzAbt 501 during the bulge:
Tigers in the Ardennes
Great detail, also restoration of the La gleize KT along with other survivors.



Very good site

 

Great site, well researched. The solid shot lodged in the KT's armour was surprising as was the caption for that photo.

Makes me want to build the Tamiya KT kit I've had for years!

Cheers

Andy

 

Looking for some caption info for gallery photos I came across this excellent site on sSSPzAbt 501 during the bulge:
Tigers in the Ardennes
Great detail, also restoration of the La gleize KT along with other survivors.

Perhaps you've read Battle of the Bulge then and now. Really more of a Pictorial of The Battle of the Ardennes then and now.



Had some good stock photos.

This was fun...
http://stevenbaffa.tripod.com/bluemaxmilitaria/index.html

Ouch $84.00

 

Excellent website VP, thanks for posting! I visited the museum at La Gleize back in 2001 and I would recommend it if you're in the area.

 

First rate site VP. Many thanks.

 

After seeing Dave's (Croonaert) post about his liking for King Tigers I stumbled across this site and thought I'd post the link.
Tigers in the Ardennes

It looks a good source of info and there's some great pictures

Cheers
Andy

 

Andy,
believe or not, the concrete type structure's where still around Aachen in 1968-70, when I was stationed at HQAFCE, my war post was as a siggy at 2 ATAF joc Maastricht, in the cave's.

Ken.

 

Interesting site - not so sure about that calendar they are promoting!

 

The author of the book is a well establish member on Wehrmacht Awards , although the calander is focused photographically on German awards the author and site do not subscribe to anything other than the values of a collecting interest.
Speaking for myself the calander I could live with but if the plates showed the RK portraits of the "heros" of the Waffen SS or similarly presnted images I would pass.
( Purely by chance I read a few minutes ago a description from a well known UK author in which Christian Tychsen was praised as being "a brave armour commander who died in the service of his country" - to me he certainly did not die in "the service of his country".)

Although I would differ slightly in my perceptions of the calander from Paul I would have some reservations as to how the passed is viewed and the level of objectivity applied by some.
( "The Myth of the Eastern Front" - previously menetioned by Paul - I have ordered a copy in PB , should be interesting).

As far as the King Tiger goes not the tank for that enviroment , covering that ground over long distances disected by river bridges which could not support their weight - the whole advanture being under resourced.
Just as Rommel came to depend on captured supplies in 1942 , the same state of affairs had come to exist in 1944/45.

The Soviets having "tested" several captured King Tigers (as targets) found that the quality of the armour in the tanks varied - the quality being quite poor - a sign that all was not well in German industry .
It has been said that in terms of German vs Russia that Quantity overcame Quality - but the Tiger did assume something of a legend which did not take into account its imperfections and by towards the end of the war the quality of production was failing and the number of veteran soldiers was fast disappearing from the front line.

Andrew mentioned the "Battle of The Bulge" (the movie) - one of the really bad ones.
My father often referred to what he called The Hollywood Hussars who saved the day , just in the nick of time.

 

James,
I remember reading a russian report on the King Tiger and the fact that the manufacture was poor along with the poor quality Armour Plates that were used.

Apparently the welds sprung when receiving a hit or near miss on the weld.
Having said that I have seen a good photo of a King Tiger with one of the crew pointing out the hits received to the Front Plate, without penetration. (Photo Attached)
Perhaps that was an earlier model with better build quality!

I have attached a few Pictures of the King Tiger for all the Tankies out there.

Regards

Tom

 

Tom , I think we saw the same document - source wise I can't remember it - the photos you have shown are mostly from Normandy and likewise I took the examples tested by the Soviets to be late production models.

Found some on it, via on line sources.

Was the Tiger really King? - THE RUSSIAN BATTLEFIELD

Äîêëàäíàÿ îá îïûòàõ ñî 100-ìì è 122-ìì ïóøêàìè - THE RUSSIAN BATTLEFIELD

Tiger II - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Achtung Panzer! - TIGER-TAMERS - Battle for Sandomierz Bulge - August of 1944

http://the.shadock.free.fr/Surviving_Tigers.pdf
( One of the best on line sites , IMHO. )

 

James - I think it was just that first image on the calendar to be honest. It just looked rather 'odd'.

I have almost finished 'Myth of the Eastern Front'. It's a good read; think they labour the points a little, and don't always explain why the 'myths' are myths, but it is certainly an interesting book. Will add some comments on that thread I started in due course.

 

Sorry Paul , picked you up the wrong way , German Cross in Gold , feathers make it bit "artey".
Some referred to it as "Hitler's fried egg" , whilst it had to be earned , it was not popular with all - Hans Von Luck ( for example) only wore his when situations demanded that he had to.

Paul your views as a professional historian on the book and the views expressed would be of interest .

 

This photo dates from Normandy as far as I am aware - it would be some of the first Tiger II's .
The soviets did seem to find that later production models did have quailty control issues , either that or its war time propaganda , or they just got a " Friady afternoon" model.

The use of lesser quailty materials did bedevil the German war industries as the closing stages of the war came on - the Type XXI / XXIII boats had problems with the qualities of metal as did the jet engine production.
That the similar problems found their way into tank production I would certainly not rule out - how widespread were they , maybe not every tank but a reasonable percentage of them ?

Accurately quantifying the extent of any problem would be difficult - but to simply say "no" does not give the soviets a fair crack of the whip or take into account what they had to say - I am going to keep an open mind on this one.

 

but to simply say "no" does not give the soviets a fair say.

I found that once I 'previewed' the post I couild not edit in any other words. The Images took over the preview and locked me out. I tried to edit it later but I gave up and left it as it was.
The point of the post is to show that the famous photo of a deflection on the glacis of this Tiger (sPzAbt 503, Normandy) is a fake. The original unaltetred pic is shown beside the fake.

 

No worries Michael , Gremlins are all at home in "PC world ".
The fake photo - the bottom one ( circled).
Thanks for posting this one - I have only seen the "top" photo before as per "Panzers in Normandy".
I was looking at the two for "landmarks" , the bottom one does appear to have been worked on.
May I ask where this second version is published ?
thanks
js