The Sixth Army Sacrificed at Stalingrad?

Discussion in 'The Eastern Front' started by kfz, Nov 6, 2006.

  1. the_beezer

    the_beezer Junior Member

    The biggest fact missing here is Paulus was the figurehead of 6th army while Schmidt actually pulled the strings. Hitler allowed the flanks of 6th army to be guarded by under supplied Romanian divisions.
     
  2. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    Beezer,

    Whilst I have to agree with you about the inferior equipped Axis troops on the flanks of Stalingrad, I have to add that it would be pure conjecture to believe that if the flanks were covered by German Army troops they would have faired better.

    I have a German friend who is a retired Lt Col in the Bundeswehr and whose father was a Major in the 14th Panzer Division.

    This unit was equipped with Mk IV Panzers with short 75 mm canon.

    They were hit by massed formations of T34's and were annihilated after exhausing all their ammunition.

    My friends father was lucky to survive the encounter and the subsequent incarceration in Siberia until 1949.

    Major Ha├čel (Hassel) was the holder of a Knights Cross and said that on the POW Train East, he could see train loads of new T34's being brought West.

    He said then that the war was lost.

    Regards
    Tom
     
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  3. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    TCS -
    Some would argue that the Germans had lost the war at both El Alamein and Cap Bon Tunisia when 250,000 axis troops surrendered to the 1st and 8th British Armies - before they surrendered at Stalingrad.....proving that they were NOT invincible

    Cheers
     
  4. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    Tom,

    I agree with your comments.

    However I do not think that the German and Axis rank and file in Russia knew too much about the reversals in the North African campaign.

    Regards
    Tom (TCS)
     
  5. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Tcs -
    Nevertheless - the head honchos in Berlin certainly knew of them as Rommel was fired early then Von Ahrnim also

    Cheers
     
  6. Wills

    Wills Very Senior Member

    300 documents/photos. I will look in the archives later for more:





    Bundesarchiv - Picture database:


    type in Stalingrad in search box. No dates - 300 docs/photo's with links for each photo/doc (or type in title of choice)




    athene-5a4rx1twuu815yzrclz1_layout.jpg
     
  7. sol

    sol Very Senior Member

    TCS -
    Some would argue that the Germans had lost the war at both El Alamein and Cap Bon Tunisia when 250,000 axis troops surrendered to the 1st and 8th British Armies - before they surrendered at Stalingrad.....proving that they were NOT invincible

    Cheers

    Sorry Tom but German 6th Army in Stalingrad surrendered in February 1943, before Axis troops in the North Africa did the same in May.
     
  8. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    300 documents/photos. I will look in the archives later for more:

    Bundesarchiv - Picture database:

    View attachment 91643

    Wills,

    I have managed to find a photograph of my friends father from the Link that you supplied.


    [​IMG]




    There is a photograph in the book I have on the 14th Panzer Division, it is grainy but shows him in conversation with General Hoth and Major Grams.

    Regards
    Tom
     
  9. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Sol

    you may be right about the date of the Stalingrad surrender -but as we were still at it we probably got the news late ..
    Cheers
     
  10. Wills

    Wills Very Senior Member

    For anyone wishing to cross reference information:

    Your browser - 'Bundesarchiv' - Click Bundesarchiv Picture data base (or bild)

    Bundesarchiv home page (click translate)

    if you wish to see photographs type title of interest in search box'

    For other. click Topic Search - the classification box will display titles eg. 1939 - 45 will bring up WW2 subtitles which can be expanded to detailed titles Wermacht. Panzer, battles etc. On occasion an error will show, go back to classification and re -click.

    good hunting!



    Department of the Army - Historial Study Pamphlet No. 20-261a - German Campaign in Russia - Planning and Operations
     
  11. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    Wills,

    I have managed to find a photograph of my friends father from the Link that you supplied.


    [​IMG]




    There is a photograph in the book I have on the 14th Panzer Division, it is grainy but shows him in conversation with General Hoth and Major Grams.

    Regards
    Tom

    I received an email from my friend stating that the photograph was indeed his late Father and the photograph was taken in Bad Harz early in 1950, shortly after repatriation back to Germany.

    Records apparently show that he was promoted to Lt Colonel before his capture.

    Regards
    Tom
     

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