The Better Sniper Rifles Of Ww2

Does anyone have any guess as to which sniper rifle was the strongest among the models. Was it the einfield? Was is the Mogin Nagat? I am totally clueless. I was under the influence that the Einfield was the better of all sniper rifles. Can some one give me there opinion on this subject?

 

You need to define what you mean by "the best"-- some were more reliable, some were more accurate, etc. Generally, I would vote for the M-1 C/D Garand. Accurate, reliable, and of most importance, self-loading. A sniper does not necessarily need rapid follow-up shots, but it is motion which gives away the position of a sniper. There is less motion if he uses a semi-auto rather than a bolt action rifle. Doc

 

(Hidden_Sniper @ Dec 17 2005, 04:12 AM) [post=43230]Does anyone have any guess as to which sniper rifle was the strongest among the models. Was it the einfield? Was is the Mogin Nagat? I am totally clueless. I was under the influence that the Einfield was the better of all sniper rifles. Can some one give me there opinion on this subject?
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From what I have read the Mosin-Nagant 1891/30 Sniper Rifle was the preferred article.

Very reliable and the action made practically no noise.

http://www.snipercentral.com/mosin.htm

The 1891/30 Sniper proved to be an exceptional sniper rifle, perhaps even the best of WWII. The rifles were mass-produced, with as many as 330,000 of the sniper variants being produced between 1941 and 1943. Of course, due to these types of production numbers, some problems arose. There were numerous complaints about the triggers, they were not adjustable, and so what came with the rifle was what you were stuck with, so hopefully it was adjusted nicely from the factory. Another complaint was with the stock, as some of the wood used during some of the high production times was not high quality and warped a lot during changes in weather. The rifles were also long and heavy which made them a bit awkward in the field. But, despite all that, these rifles were very accurate. Average accuracy was about 1.5 MOA with some examples shooting WELL below 1 MOA. This level of accuracy is amazing for a rifle produced during wartime conditions and in these numbers. It is believed that many German snipers in WWII would use captured 1891/30's as their personal sniper rifles, over their Mauser 98K's.

 

Personally I would go for the Lee Enfield Mk4T. Accurare, Rugged, Reliable and comfortable to use. They and a slightly modified version the L42A1 were in use in the British Army until the late 1980's.

I have used one once and found it easy to adapt to. Normally I shoot .22 Target rifles but using the L42 version I was able to average 86 out of 100 at ranges up to 1,000 yards. Remembering that I had never shot a full bore rifle before this was way above what I expected to get.

For this reason alone I would go for the Lee Enfield

 

the lee enfield was a very accurite rifle no dout with that, i don't know much about the m-1 garand sniper rifle. personally i waould choose the mosin nagant sniper rifle, rugged, lots of spare parts, fairly accurite. and there is also the simonov and tokarov editions of the svd-40 witch were pretty good too.

 

Hey, Dont you mean the svt-40 because I thought (happy to be corrected) that the svd-40 was a later evaluated model used in the vietnam war. Please post as I am not quite sure.
Thanks,
Jack

 

(Lt. Winters @ Dec 18 2005, 10:22 AM) [post=43290]Hey, Dont you mean the svt-40 because I thought (happy to be corrected) that the svd-40 was a later evaluated model used in the vietnam war. Please post as I am not quite sure.
Thanks,
Jack
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Hi Jack,

Make up your own mind!

http://www.snipercentral.com/mosin.htm

The 1891/30 Sniper rifle was originally developed in the early 20's (on the Dragoon rifle) and used in the 30's (as the 1891/30). Like many countries did before and during the war, the USSR was switching over to semi-auto combat rifles, the SVT-40, and a sniper variant was produced of this rifle. But accuracy was not up to par and many complaints over the SVT-40 sniper rifle prompted the return of the 1891/30 , which performed very will throughout the war. The rifle stayed in service until 1963 when it was replaced in the USSR military by the SVD. The 1891/30 Sniper's stayed in service until the 70's with many communist countries. It actually served with the NVA during the Vietnam Conflict as well. This rifle has an exceptional service history and performance history and deserves to be placed among the greatest of all service built sniper rifles.

 

(Doc @ Dec 17 2005, 08:14 AM) [post=43259]There is less motion if he uses a semi-auto rather than a bolt action rifle.
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But it is possible to spot the ejecting cartridge from a semi-auto rifle.

For this reason, the Modern British Forces prefer a Bolt Action rifle. The "Spent" cartridge can always be disposed of later, if needed.
It's widely regarded that the Royal Marines Sniper school is one of the best. It's this reason that many forces train their own snipers alongside the RM's.

Also... Back to WW2...

Why hasn't anybody mentioned the Good Ol' '03 Springfield?

Mark

 

Just had a look at the site, link provided by Spidge.

Whoa!!!

You gotta give it to those Russians... How many in the list??? images/smilies/default/ohmy.gif

 

(Lt. Winters @ Dec 18 2005, 10:22 AM) [post=43290]Hey, Dont you mean the svt-40 because I thought (happy to be corrected) that the svd-40 was a later evaluated model used in the vietnam war. Please post as I am not quite sure.
Thanks,
Jack
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Hi Jack,

I misread your quote however........http://club.guns.ru/eng/dragunov.html

SSV-58, prototype 08

our earlier research on the SVD development like in prevailing number of other Soviet sources it was believed that the first prototype of the SVD sniper rifle was produced in 1959. Later and more accurate investigation, however, allowed us to discover the SVD (SSV - Snayperskaya Samozariadnaya Vintovka - sniper auto-loading rifle) dated 1958

 

It's one of those skills where the qualities of the equipment and the user work together. The sniper has to know exactly what he and his rifle are capable of, and exploit his fieldcraft to bring it to bear in a situation where it'll be effective.

So long as it's adequate and free of obvious vices, the rifle is secondary; the user paramount.

Regards,
MikB

 

The No.4(T) or M1941 Springfield would be my choice. Very accurate, rugged, and a smooth bolt action. A self-loader isn't the best choice for a sniper rifle and it's not because of accuracy. My M1D sniper rifle is every bit as accurate as my bolt-action rifles, but the brass flying from the action is a dead giveaway to an experienced enemy. A sniper when manipulating the bolt after a shot, does it very slowly and often removes the shell casing with his fingers so as not to allow sunlight to glint off of it. The Nagant was a good sniper rifle, very reliable, but the 7.62X54mm rimmed round is slightly less accurate than the 7.92X57mm. The .303 used in the No.4(T) is an excellent round and did well in sniper rifles. The .30-06 Springfield is the flattest shooting of all the rounds, but the American sniper rifles firing it lacked sufficient optics, aside from the Marine Corps M1941 Springfield fitted with the Unertl telescopic sight. So here's my choices in order:

1.M1941 (USMC M1903 w/ Unertl)
2.Lee-Enfield No.4(T)
3.Mauser Kar98k 'High Turret'
4.Mosin-Nagant 91/30 w/ PU

The M1C and D weren't used enough in the war for me to compare it to the other rifles.

 

(GarandGuy @ Dec 19 2005, 02:15 PM) [post=43342]The No.4(T) or M1941 Springfield would be my choice. Very accurate, rugged, and a smooth bolt action. A self-loader isn't the best choice for a sniper rifle and it's not because of accuracy. My M1D sniper rifle is every bit as accurate as my bolt-action rifles, but the brass flying from the action is a dead giveaway to an experienced enemy. A sniper when manipulating the bolt after a shot, does it very slowly and often removes the shell casing with his fingers so as not to allow sunlight to glint off of it. The Nagant was a good sniper rifle, very reliable, but the 7.62X54mm rimmed round is slightly less accurate than the 7.92X57mm. The .303 used in the No.4(T) is an excellent round and did well in sniper rifles. The .30-06 Springfield is the flattest shooting of all the rounds, but the American sniper rifles firing it lacked sufficient optics, aside from the Marine Corps M1941 Springfield fitted with the Unertl telescopic sight. So here's my choices in order:

1.M1941 (USMC M1903 w/ Unertl)
2.Lee-Enfield No.4(T)
3.Mauser Kar98k 'High Turret'
4.Mosin-Nagant 91/30 w/ PU

The M1C and D weren't used enough in the war for me to compare it to the other rifles.
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I suppose you can only shoot with what you have however look at the numbers here. Plenty of snaps of the women who partiipated as well.

One Russian sniper also killed 70 enemy snipers. (The Snipers Sniper)

http://wio.ru/galgrnd/sniper/sniper.htm

 

What was the more accurate of these selections? That is what I am up for, I've been to many different forums, and they said that the Mosin Nagant was the more accuarte weapon.

 

(Hidden_Sniper @ Dec 19 2005, 11:50 AM) [post=43363]What was the more accurate of these selections? That is what I am up for, I've been to many different forums, and they said that the Mosin Nagant was the more accuarte weapon.
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Probably the Mauser 98 variants, insofar as that question can be answered at all. Remember the rifles might be extensively worked on either by a skilled armourer responsible for a unit's sniping rifles, or by the snipers themselves, so the actual capabilities could at best have been substantially better than 'as issued'.

Because of this, and the importance of the sniper's fieldcraft skills, there really isn't a definitive answer to your question. One type might've been more accurate than another - on average - according to one set of tests or another, but it's another matter to decide if the tests were fair and realistic, and even if you or I think they were, there may still be overlapping exceptions.

Regards,
MikB

 

(Hidden_Sniper @ Dec 19 2005, 10:50 PM) [post=43363]What was the more accurate of these selections? That is what I am up for, I've been to many different forums, and they said that the Mosin Nagant was the more accuarte weapon.
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As MikB has stated there is not a definitive answer.

The Russians turned sniping into an art and the rifle they used was the Mosin Nagant.

You will have to make up your own mind.

 

The accuracy of all the rifles I've mentioned are roughly the same. The M1903 and Kar98k share the same action, which is very strong and simple. The No.4 uses rear locking lugs which theoretically are weaker than the 98k's forward locking lugs. In practice it doesn't make a difference. All the rifles I mentioned including the post WWII M1C and D fire 1 MOA. The biggest difference is the trajectory and velocity of the rounds. The 7.62X54mm fired by the Mosin-Nagant was an archaic round even by WWII standards. The Russian M1908 round was a 148 gr. bullet fired at 2,759 fps which is slow for such a light bullet. It held a fairly flat trajectory but dropped quicker than the other rounds and lost much knockdown power after 500m. The .303 MkVII was a heavy 170 gr bullet fired at 2,539 fps. This is slower than the Russian m1908 but it made up for it with the heavy bullet. The velocity of the round matched well with the weight of the bullet which allowed it to hold good trajectory and knockdown power at range. The German s-patrone 98 was a 154 gr bullet fired at 2,650 fps. It was faster and heavier than the Russian M1908 but once again lost velocity quickly compared to the American and British rounds. The best round of all, the American 150 gr M2 .30-06 ball round had a muzzle velocity of 2,837 fps. This was the fastest of all the rounds and held the flattest trajectory. It also retained more knockdown power at long range than the others. So all in all the most accurate and longest ranged rifle is the M1941 Springfield sniper rifle with the No.4(T) coming in a close second.

 

It's NOT what you got, it's how you use it...

As they say.. images/smilies/default/biggrin.gif

 

(Pte1643 @ Dec 20 2005, 09:06 PM) [post=43413]It's NOT what you got, it's how you use it...

As they say.. images/smilies/default/biggrin.gif
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And the Russians were prolific snipers and knew how to use it well.

 

Everyone knows that. The battle of Stalingrad was pretty much filled with snipers, and not just this battle, other places in the entire country of Russia. I knew the Russians were the best sniping country...ever! But I was just curious as to whether their was a better sniper rifle in the world that wasn't getting credit for aiding those few unmentioned british, american, french, and japanese soldiers that did do some sniping, but not enough to be recognized in the top 100 snipers (As you not most of the top 100 snipers are from the European front.)<span style="font-family:Georgia"> </span>