Strange collar badge

Discussion in 'WW2 Militaria' started by DanMorris1989, Nov 12, 2018.

  1. DanMorris1989

    DanMorris1989 Member

    The buttons on this uniform denote the Royal Artillery but I can't get to the bottom of the meaning behind the G o the collar

    Anybody know?

    Also I believe it belonged to a WW2 veteran.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    My only guess is G = Garrison (as opposed to Field) or Gibraltar - as said its a guess

    TD
     
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  3. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    Perhaps you could confirm his name from the label inside, something LAZENBY. There are a number in the casualty returns.

    Gunner?
     
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  4. Richard Lewis

    Richard Lewis Member

  5. Trux

    Trux 21 AG Patron

    Could it be 'G' Battery, Royal Horse Artillery? I have no evidence for this.

    Mike
     
  6. Richard Lewis

    Richard Lewis Member

    You might be on to something there Mike.

    Looking closer at the buttons they are ball buttons with the Royal Artillery badge. This signifies RHA; “normal” RA regiments wear half-ball buttons. RHA also have, today, their own collar badge, not to mention their own stable belt, cap badge (sorry, that should read cypher), etc. etc.

    Looks like he only has the Long Service and Good Conduct Medal, no WW2 medals.

    Richard.
    p.s. Dan, have you mislaid your iron?:D
     
  7. redtop

    redtop Well-Known Member

    Think that is a Number 2 Dress Jacket.
    Battledress was replaced by it in the 60's.
    Not sure if Artillery wear Red sash usually an Infantry thing.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2018
  8. DanMorris1989

    DanMorris1989 Member

    Yes seems a bit of a mish mash of memorable here. It's a friends who was left it by a relative but has no evidence that a 'Lazenby' was related to her.

    She was asking my opinion on it and she seems to think it's worth thousands as she's 'looked it up on eBay' ... I had to bear her the unfortunate news that in my opinion it was not worth the thousands she thought ... I could be wrong but would say its not even worth 100.

    I seem to think that it's an RA or RHA jacket originally and thereafter someone has accessorised it with the G's and the Sash.

    It's a strange one ... I wouldn't even know if Bdr Lazenby whose jacket it was ever got the LSGC or ever became a Sgt.

    It's a puzzle ... she's also had presumed it was from the first world war and I thought that that too was highly unlikely.

    The only way it would lean towards 100 or so would be if you could Lazenby's history and service to it much like a medal stamped with rank name and number etc automatically adds to the value of a product to associate it with one particular man or woman
     
  9. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Unless there is something very special that can be properly validated and thereby provenance established, the sad thing is that it would go in auction for only a few pounds - tens of pounds at the most - when it would likely then be broken up and sold on eBay because the sum of the 'parts' would be more than the sum of the 'whole'. Sad - and not to be condoned - but that's the World we live in.

    Edit: .....and those are not WW2 buttons - the finish is too bright - unless the light is playing tricks. The uniform is also incomplete because it looks like an arm badge has been removed (mounting holes still visible).
     
  10. DanMorris1989

    DanMorris1989 Member

    SDP

    my thoughts exactly re value and arm badge etc. Guess my hunch and studying both world wars for many years has led me to the same conclusion as you guys in this thread

    Dan
     
  11. DanMorris1989

    DanMorris1989 Member

    PS also had a good feeling that it was later than WW2 as well but no harm in asking the Pros
     
  12. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Just looked up the sash - Sergeants sash - on eBay and the going rate is broadly £5 to £20.
     
  13. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    Any chance of a clear view of the medal ribbon, there looks to only be one, and its unclear - if it was WW2 then there would nominally be at least two - there is also something odd just above the medal ribbon

    TD
     
  14. Swiper

    Swiper Resident Sospan

    About a tenner from any Army surplus.
     
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  15. DanMorris1989

    DanMorris1989 Member

    Yeah gathered it wouldn't be a lot ... I certainly would pay over £20 max in my opinion. She's dead set that it's worth a lot even without my opinion.
    I guess she will find out the hard way when she doesn't quote hit the 1k mark when she attempts to sell it
     
  16. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Could be wrong - not my specialty - but aren't they loops for attaching a medals mounting bar?
     
  17. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Top end bid £25 (but not by me!) - it's not really been looked after at all with clearly bits missing - subject to the caveat in my post #9. Her only hope - presumably she wants to sell - is to establish some really good derring do provenance.

    Note: I made a similar mistake a few years ago, relating to value, thinking that a uniform was well over my budget so I didn't even contemplate bidding: it went for only £30 including buyers premium and that was an officers full uniform complete with Sam Browne belt etc etc. Been kicking myself ever since......
     
  18. robins2

    robins2 Active Member

    red sash usually connected to Color Sgt./escort for colors etc.
     
  19. redtop

    redtop Well-Known Member

    Red Sash worn by Infantry Sergeants and above (SNCO's) as formal dress on Parades and if carrying out duty such as Duty Sergeant..
    A full Escort to the Colours would be 2 Colour Sgts and a Wo11 all wearing Sashes.
    The Sash goes back to the days when Sergeants carried swords , I was told on gaining my sash that there was one tassel on Sash for every Regiment of the Line,(Could be an urban legend)
    Sashes are not worn by Corp SNCO's not sure about Artillery.
    There may be exceptions to above due to Regiment/Corp traditions.
    .
     
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  20. Marcus H

    Marcus H Member

    I, too, would agree, this is a contemporary ORs, No. 2 Dress jacket - the anodised buttons and chevron pattern are also an indication to certainly a more modern era.

    The holes above the rank chevrons are for arm badge devices, which would likely be the “Gun” - this arm badge looks like the RA cap badge devoid of the scroll and crown, unless possibly they continue the “Master” arm badges? Alas, I’m really not familiar with RA distinctions.

    Yes, Steve, the purpose of the loops above the ribbon bar is to accommodate the medal bar pin, the more loops sewn would indicate multiple medals. So this individuals ribbon acknowledges he has served a minimum of fifteen-years in the Regular Army to attain the LSGC medal.

    As for the “G” collars, I can but only highly suspect these are a bogus embellishment and do not belong on the uniform in question.

    The Red Sash (crimson for ceremonial duties and scarlet for duty personnel, i.e. Sgts & WOs; also the material differs for each intended sash use of, be it silk, cotton or polyester) is an Infantry/Guards Division dress distinction, plus those units (Corps) with Infantry traditions (one example being the Royal Army Physical Training Corps) inherited on the formation of, or indeed continued to wear the red sash on the appointnent of a “new” designation. With the exception of the Rifles and Brigade of Gurkhas, they would wear the black belt and pouch.

    Unfortunately, I’m far from conversant with the pros and cons. Although, the Dress Regulations basically prescribe the above. However, to the contrary, informal or even strictly the legitimacy of practices thereafter...I couldn’t begin to comment on, or for that matter remember.

    If I’m not mistaken some other non infantry “derived” Corps do wear sashes, but not red, thus likely their own distinctive colour. Then again, on specific public duties there are exceptions made to the “rules” regardless.

    Best,

    Marcus
     
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