Sqn Ldr James Foulsham (109 Sqn): 582 Sqn Oboe Lancaster attack on V1 site Foret de Croc 20 Jul 1944

Henry,

I am so pleased that you have made contact. Weasel and I have recently prepared a summary of events which we have just circulated to the relatives with whom we are so far in contact.

I suggest you send me a private message (click on the User CP tab above and then on Send a New Private Message) and you can either provide me with your e-mail address (so that I can send you the summary) or we can communicate in private regarding the events of 20 July 1944 and your family history. Alternatively, just post a reply on the thread.

What can you tell me about Thomas Charles Bower?

I will be out for much of this afternoon, but can catch up this evening or tomorrow.

Regards.

 

Thomas Charles Bower

amber13 (Henry)

I have just been in touch with Weasel (Chris) who tells me that when he visited the Dieppe Cemetery in August there was an old poppy cross placed by Thomas Charles Bower's headstone. Does this mean that you or one of your family may have visited his grave recently?

I should be most grateful if you could please let me have whatever information you have about him to add to the story of the events. I have posted a Private Message to you to introduce myself in more detail. If you are having difficulty in navigating your way around the forum and locating messages, please just post a "Quick Reply" to say so on this thread and I can try to help. You will find the private message by clicking on UserCP on the bar at the top of the page, and then on the left hand side of the page which opens you will see a box headed Private Messages from which you should be able to find the message in your inbox.

I can (hopefully) also help with tracing the family history, but you may prefer to do that privately either by direct e-mail contact or by using the Private Message facility on the forum. Just address your message to BobKat14 and we can discuss.

Looking forward to hearing further.

 

amber13 (Henry)

Can you confirm that your father was a pilot in the RAF. If so I think I know the family link to Flt Sgt Bower

 

Information gathered

This thread has now attracted over 1,000 views. It seems, therefore, to be an appropriate time to provide an update on our activities.

We are now in touch with the families of seven out of the eight crew members. The elusive relatives are those of John Swarbrick. We believe that his daughter Ann Marie (Harrison) had a daughter Sandra Marie (now Aspinall) living in the Bolton area. Our attempts to make contact have proved fruitless. If anyone reading this knows of their whereabouts and can put me in touch, it would be much appreciated. We have much information to share.

We now know that Jim Foulsham and Ben Weightman were both flying with the RAF at the outbreak of the war, with 57 Sqn and 269 Sqn respectively. John Swarbrick enlisted in 1940 and flew a tour as a navigator with 115 Sqn. The rest of the crew did not come together until 1943 when they first flew with 156 Sqn before being transferred to 582 Sqn. They had all flown over 30 missions by 20 July 1944.

From information circulated by the families, we have photographs of all the crew (except Swarbrick) and a surviving Log Book for their time with 156 and 582 Sqns. We have the Service Records from RAF Cranwell and are awaiting the equivalent information from Canada for MacArthur. We are in touch with people in the local commune in France and have a number of eye-witness accounts. There is much else, to the extent that our written record compiled for the use of the families of the crew now extends to over 100 pages. There may still be a bit more information to come when remaining attics have been searched, but collectively we have now nearly completed the story of Lancaster ED908 (60-Z) as a tribute to those who died.

If anyone reading this has anything to add or would like any information about the events, please post a reply on this thread or send me a private message.

 

We have now reached the stage where we are trying to identify pieces of wreckage found. We have had reasonable success, but have had no luck with the following (photos attached). Can anyone help?

Query 1. We have identified the circular frame at the bottom right as being from the pilot's compass, but what about the round object within it, and the items along the top row?

Query 5. (added as the last item) What is the lever-shaped item? The other objects were found close by - are they connected in some way?

Query 7. This has an Air Ministry mark 5[? - illegible]/870 and therefore seems to be part of some electrical apparatus, but what?

Queries 4, 8, 9, 14. Any ideas for these distinctively shaped fragments?

Query A. We have identified the piece at the bottom of the main picture as a former from the bomb bay area and the round disk with six holes and a straight edge as part of the hydraulic jack attachment, but what about the other pieces? Could the object on the left of centre (also pictured from the opposite side) be part of a gauge from the instrument panel?

Query B. What is this hook(?) with an Air Ministry mark attached to a fragment of metal which may be some form of container? It doesn't seem to be a fire extinguisher.

Query C. Another distinctively shaped piece, but what is it?

I should be grateful to receive any thoughts.

 

With the help of Lincolnshire Aviation Heritage Centre we have managed to identify some of the items pictured in the previous post. So, for the record:

Along the top row of Photo 1 from the left: a steady bar or turnbuckle from the 4,000lb "cookie" bomb carrier; a parachute D-ring; and some brake shoe parts.

Photo 7 seems to be an electrical box cover.

Photo 14 is a bomb hoist point located on the longeron above the bomb bay.

The item to the left of centre in Photo A is thought to be an oil temperature (or pressure?) gauge.

Photo B shows a lever from a carbon dioxide inflation canister, possibly from a Mae West jacket or from the aircraft's dinghy. I have found a picture of the former, but have been unable to find a picture of the latter complete with lever attached. So this could be from either source.

There are many other pieces, now 27 in all, which have been identified including a shattered fragment of the master compass casing, with part of the original typewritten instructions for handling still attached.

Our record of the events of 20 July 1944 now comprises 168 pages and is currently being printed for circulation to the families of the crew. Our research has therefore come to a close, but any additional information or comments on this thread will always be welcome.

 

I am very pleased to record that this thread has recently attracted the attention of another relative - a cousin's cousin with whom I am now in touch following a private message.

In May my wife and I visited the crash site in France where wreckage is still being recovered in a search organised by the local villagers. We were greeted with a trestle table full of newly discovered pieces - mostly fragments scattered by the impact of the crash, but with some clearly identifiable pieces. As far as I can ascertain all the main fuselage was removed from the crash site during the war following the discovery of the wreckage by Canadian forces advancing in August 1944, just a month after the aircraft came down. It is therefore only small parts which remain to be discovered after nearly 70 years beneath the ground.

Several of the items, pictures of which I have posted previously, have now been identified, including a turnbuckle from the bomb carrier, a parachute pack D-ring (the internal frame for a pack has just been found), a fuel tank inspection door, and a piece of fuselage former from above the bomb door hinge.

Perhaps one of the more unusual finds has been two fragments of the master compass casing on which part of the inscription "THIS IS A DELICATE INSTRUMENT / HANDLE WITH EXTREME CARE / DO NOT DROP OR JAR" is clearly visible. If anyone is interested I can post a photograph.

I am struggling to identify some of the more recently discovered items and I attach three photographs in the hope that somebody might be able to help.

A is a fragment of a dial with the numbers ranging from 780 to 880 visible on about half its (presumed full circular) circumference. The numbers all point inwards to the centre (rather than all being upright as on a convential instrument gauge). This suggests that the dial turns and is read from the bottom. On this basis it seems unlikely to be a pressure gauge connected with the hydraulic system, for example, but perhaps that it is more likely to be a radio tuning dial? However it does not seem to fit with the dials of any of the normal radio transmitters on board. It should be mentioned that this aircraft was the pioneering operational Oboe Lancaster, and that it would have had more sophisticated electronic equipment on board. Does anyone know anything about this dial?

B is a piece of glass with two bolt notches on its right side and what seems to be the remnants of a metal attachment. I have looked at pictures of the gun turrets on a Lancaster - it might be from one of these. It has also been suggested that it could be part of the H2S blister. This equipment would have been redundant with the Oboe system installed, but the blister may have remained from the aircraft's time as a conventional bomber. Does anyone have any thoughts?

C has an Air Ministry mark - 10B/169 - the code for Radio (Wireless and Radar) Aerial and Mast Equipment and Insulators, but I cannot find out exactly what these pieces are. Does anyone recognise the shape or the reference number?

All help or comments will be gratefully received.

 

I am very pleased to record that this thread has recently attracted the attention of another relative - a cousin's cousin with whom I am now in touch following a private message.

In May my wife and I visited the crash site in France where wreckage is still being recovered in a search organised by the local villagers. We were greeted with a trestle table full of newly discovered pieces - mostly fragments scattered by the impact of the crash, but with some clearly identifiable pieces. As far as I can ascertain all the main fuselage was removed from the crash site during the war following the discovery of the wreckage by Canadian forces advancing in August 1944, just a month after the aircraft came down. It is therefore only small parts which remain to be discovered after nearly 70 years beneath the ground.

Several of the items, pictures of which I have posted previously, have now been identified, including a turnbuckle from the bomb carrier, a parachute pack D-ring (the internal frame for a pack has just been found), a fuel tank inspection door, and a piece of fuselage former from above the bomb door hinge.

Perhaps one of the more unusual finds has been two fragments of the master compass casing on which part of the inscription "THIS IS A DELICATE INSTRUMENT / HANDLE WITH EXTREME CARE / DO NOT DROP OR JAR" is clearly visible. If anyone is interested I can post a photograph.

I am struggling to identify some of the more recently discovered items and I attach three photographs in the hope that somebody might be able to help.

A is a fragment of a dial with the numbers ranging from 780 to 880 visible on about half its (presumed full circular) circumference. The numbers all point inwards to the centre (rather than all being upright as on a convential instrument gauge). This suggests that the dial turns and is read from the bottom. On this basis it seems unlikely to be a pressure gauge connected with the hydraulic system, for example, but perhaps that it is more likely to be a radio tuning dial? However it does not seem to fit with the dials of any of the normal radio transmitters on board. It should be mentioned that this aircraft was the pioneering operational Oboe Lancaster, and that it would have had more sophisticated electronic equipment on board. Does anyone know anything about this dial?

B is a piece of glass with two bolt notches on its right side and what seems to be the remnants of a metal attachment. I have looked at pictures of the gun turrets on a Lancaster - it might be from one of these. It has also been suggested that it could be part of the H2S blister. This equipment would have been redundant with the Oboe system installed, but the blister may have remained from the aircraft's time as a conventional bomber. Does anyone have any thoughts?

C has an Air Ministry mark - 10B/169 - the code for Radio (Wireless and Radar) Aerial and Mast Equipment and Insulators, but I cannot find out exactly what these pieces are. Does anyone recognise the shape or the reference number?

All help or comments will be gratefully received.
hi there,
I'm James Manns grandson, hope you get this message as I'd like to read more

Steve Penney

 

hi there,
I'm James Manns grandson, hope you get this message as I'd like to read more

Steve Penney
forgot
e-mail slodge29@yahoo.co.uk

 

Hi,
I think ive worked this out now.
James Mann was my grandad and that is why i am very interested in this thread. If he had been on this mission then I, and lots of my family, would not be here now. I would like to read all you have on this mission and especially why the crew was changed.if there is anything i can do please ask. my mother has told me that my grandad left some war diaries which are still in my nans loft. i will have a word with my nan (jims widow) and see if i can have a look at them.
thanks
Steve penney

 

Hello Steve,

Sorry for the slight delay in getting back to you - have been away for a family wedding - of the great niece of James Foulsham.

I should be delighted to try and pass on what I know about your grandfather. It is quite a long story which I will try to summarise.

Ben Weightman was the regular captain of a Lancaster crew of eight of which Flt Sgt James Ferry Girvan Mann, DFM, was one. He (your grandfather) had previously flown with 61 Squadron and had presumably already completed a "tour" of 30 missions. He joined the 582 Sqn crew on 15 June 1944 when Ben Weightman became a Master Bomber (directing the main force where to bomb) and there was a need for an additional navigator to help ensure the accuracy of the drop.

At the beginning of July 1944 582 Sqn acquired the pioneer Oboe Lancaster, fitted with the Oboe navigation system normally used by the Mosquito pathfinder squadrons which flew at about twice the height and twice the speed. The senior crews in 582 Sqn started to take it in turns to fly the new aircraft, but as they were not accustomed to the Oboe system, two of the crew's navigators were taken off the flight and replaced by a 109 (Mosquito) Sqn pilot and navigator to control the bombing run. On 20 July 1944 Ben Weightman would have taken off the aircraft and then, over the Channel, changed seats and handed over to James Foulsham with his navigator, John Swarbrick, for the bombing run.

As far as I can tell ED908 (in its new role) had flown five successful missions bombing through cloud (which was the function of the Oboe system). Sadly on the mission on 20 July 1944 the skies were clear and the aircraft was an easy target for the German anti-aircraft gunners. We have spoken to two eye-witnesses from the local village where the aircraft came down who have told us what they saw. This fits with what we know from the squadron records and reports of the crews flying alongside.

As you will have gathered I have a great deal of information about the mission, but very little about your grandfather, who, as far as I can tell, died in Dorset in 1975 - would this be correct?

If you are able to trace his RAF log book or diaries these would be of great interest.

Please let me know what else you would like to know. We can continue this dialogue by exchanges on this thread, or if you would prefer to do so privately, please send me a private message with your e-mail address.

I shall look forward to hearing more from you.

 

Jim Mann

Steve,

I am not sure what has happened, but a month has gone by and we seem to have failed to make direct contact. I have sent you a couple of e-mails (having spotted the address you provided which I had originally overlooked!), and also a Private Message via the forum which does not seem to have been read. Have you received my messages? I have more information to provide, but I don't want to send this until I know we are in electronic contact. I am therefore posting this message on the 'open' forum.

If you read this, please log on, and acknowledge by clicking on the "Quick Reply" button and type a message confirming what you have received, then "Post Quick Reply". Alternatively, click on "UserCP" on the toolbar and you will find a menu on the left hand side of the page which opens. Under "Private Messages" you will see "List Messages" - click on that and you will find my message to which you can respond.

I look forward to making contact.

 

Wreckage of Lancaster ED908 (60-Z)

This thread has now attracted over 2,000 views and it is gratifying that the lives of eight brave men are being remembered as a consequence. Sadly, no-one has yet been able to help with the identification of some of the wreckage of the aircraft which has been found. With Remembrance Sunday approaching I thought I would have one more attempt to see if five objects which have so far defied all attempts at identification can be recognised.

If one of the administrators (or any member) sees this post and knows of any member of the forum who might be able to help, it would be much appreciated if their attention could be drawn to my request.

My wife and I visited the Lincolnshire Aviation Heritage Centre a short while ago and were given a tour around their Lancaster, "Just Jane". Some engine parts were identified from our photographs, and I am pleased to say that the mysterious dial mentioned with my post of 31 July has now been identified as part of the barometric pressure dial on the altimeter which was used to set the air pressure reading.

Before listing the remaining items I should mention that the main fuselage was removed from the crash site during the war, and so all that remains are small pieces scattered on impact, still being found today. The continuing search has now been suspended for the winter months, and will hopefully resume next year. So far we have identified nearly 60 items.

Here are the five items (photos attached):

1. These are two D-shaped bracket-like pieces which I first thought might have secured some item of equipment, such as a fire extinguisher. They are about the same size as the large D-ring on the outside of a parachute pack. The straight edge may have been attached to a flat surface and the curved part seems to comprise two metal strips linked by a key-shaped piece at the centre (for tightening?). However the key could not be used if a solid object was enclosed - the key could not then turn! So I wondered whether they could be the pilot's rudder pedal straps, but all pictures I have seen suggest these were made of leather. Might the air-gunners have had something similar? Any ideas will be much appreciated.

5G. These two pieces were found together at some distance from the main point of impact. The piece with a lever-like attachment does not seem to be the right shape or size to be one of the throttle controls and, curiously, its pivot is placed off-centre on the circular base. Might it have been a winding lever for radio tuning or for an aerial? The other piece has a central aperture, rather like an oil pressure gauge, but it is the wrong shape, although it does seem to be the right size to be something on the instrument panel. Both these items are very distinctive in appearance - hopefully someone will recognise them?

9. It is the circular object, pictured from both sides, about which information is sought. One side is flat and the other has a "Y" shaped protrusion, as if to provide a grip for turning. However there seems to be no screw thread on the side. Both these pieces (the other of which seems to be a piece of fuel pipe), were found some distance from where the fuselage came to rest. Could the circular object be part of an oil tank?

15. This object is a flanged rectangular frame with bolts protruding and is attached to an offset base shaped to fit into a particular location. It is pictured from both sides. It might be a mounting bracket, but for what? It has also been suggested that the bolts might have secured a perspex cover, but it does not seem to be the right shape to be a compass card holder, for example. Any thoughts?

W5. These distinctively shaped items are marked 10B/169, the Air Ministry reference for Radio (Wireless and Radar) Aerial and Mast Equipment and Insulators. This narrows the field considerably, but what are they? They do not seem, as far as I can judge from my limited knowledge, to belong to any of the standard radio equipment - the T1154 Transmitter, the R1155 Receiver or the TR1196 radio (if this was the one on board), nor the Gee R1355 Receiver. I know little about the Oboe equipment which would also have been on board. This is where somebody with some knowledge of radio equipment would be of great assistance.

I should be very grateful for any help, or thoughts as to where assistance might be obtained if not from within this forum.

 

In the absence of any response from members of the forum, I have sought help elsewhere and am pleased to say that item 1 has now been identified as a pair of supporting brackets for the oxygen bottle baskets carried on board, and the larger item in 5 is a ground power socket for engine starting.

The other items remain a mystery!