Sgt Rogers VC, 2 Wiltshire Regiment: Italy map wanted

Discussion in 'Italy' started by Owen, Mar 6, 2008.

  1. sicily43

    sicily43 Senior Member

    hello Owen
    I saw that the site is only in Italian, I tried to explain the procedure with an annex on "world"
    I hope it is clear
     

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    Owen likes this.
  2. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Thanks Sicily, I worked that bit out.
    It's trying to find the area I want that is making me scream.
    So near yet so far....
     
  3. Paul Reed

    Paul Reed Ubique

    This is the National Cartographic Portal of italian environment ministery, I just selecting the anzio map
    " + theTitle + "

    Thanks for that link. I have been looking for a site like this; most useful!
     
  4. JayKay

    JayKay Junior Member

    Cheers JayKay,
    Would those WW2 co-ords work on one of the maps you mention?
    Aha! I've just checked that website you gave, any chance you can get one for me?
    158 IV NO is the one I want!!!
    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachments/italy/10922d1228669181-italy-map-wanted-map-jpg


    I'll send you the cash!
    As Paul said we couldn't find any decent maps when we were in Italy.

    Hi OWEN,

    Sorry for not responding any sooner.

    I've checked and the maps can be ordered online, and be shipped - also abroad - if you want I can give you the instructions to follow.

    Each map is only EUR 5,37, however they require a minimum order of 4 maps....

    I also noticed that OMNIMAP.COM is selling them.

    Please let me know if I can be of any further help.

    Justin
     
  5. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

  6. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

  7. TiredOldSoldier

    TiredOldSoldier Senior Member

    That site reminds me of the declassified IGM (Istituto Geografico Militare) maps I used for trekking, but most of those were in color. Those I have left are from north of Rome but Anzio area ones should still be available if someone is interested as they still are the best you can get if moving around on foot, IIRC they did not get updated all that often, I still remember a couple of bad experiences with no longer existing water sources from a Sardinia one, so we could get lucky and find one from the forties. The coordinates are standard but the map lettering may not match the allied WW2 one (but maybe yes if NATO used the WW2 grid).
     
  8. Damiano

    Damiano In the shadow of Monte Cassino

    Hi Owen,
    the co-ords are right:
    from 776369 I get, Lat: 41° 37' 34'' N Long: 12° 31' 50'' E this is the location marked (red X) in the IGM 1:25K italian map (Ardea zone) with the reference of Ardea
    [​IMG]

    this is the same, from satellite view
    [​IMG]

    follows other images below:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    a view of location from google earth:
    [​IMG]


    Best Regards, Gurdjieff

    P.S. The zone is this, but do not forget that in these conversions, there is an error of tolerance.
     
    Paul Reed and Owen like this.
  9. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Gurdjieff,
    Thanks very much for this, you are a star!!!
    There has been lots of houses built since the war , changed the feel of the place .
     
  10. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Thanks agin for those maps.
    All I've had to go by is this one in a booklet called 'Sergeant Rogers Day' by Brigadier DE Ballantine OBE MC.

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    I've used Google Street View to find this image looking northwards to the spur.
    EDIT This is looking north to Point 51, i'm sure, Point 57 is further north out of view.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    Thats quite impressive chaps - well done.

    I've just read his citation again looking at the picture above...It actually puts you right in the thick of it with a little imagination !

    I know someone who has another 181 if you're interested :D
     
  13. Paul Reed

    Paul Reed Ubique

    Excellent stuff indeed.
     
  14. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    KMZ file for Google Earth added.
    Just looking at the maps again, so their Start Line was near Point 51 & they were attacking towards Point 57.
    So that makes the action slightly furtehr NorthWest from my KMZ file by a few hundred metres.
     

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  15. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    Do you think the man made object NE of the red X location was part of the action?
     
  16. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    I think going by the sketch map & the maps Gurdjieff posted the actual action is where I've marked the yellow '?'.
    As the sketch map shows point 51.

    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachments/italy/18252d1247308851-italy-map-wanted-sgt-rogers-vc-rogers1-2-jpg
     

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  17. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Using Google Street View I've found a road near Point 57 looking across that re-entrant towards Point 51, all built up now but this is nearest I'm going to get to the NEMBO Paras position, the Carrier Platoon & Sgt Rogers attacked towards us.

    I think ?????


    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachments/italy/18253d1247309141-italy-map-wanted-sgt-rogers-vc-rogerstreetview-jpg
     

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  18. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Actually looking again I think that sketch map refers to the spur due north of Gurd's red cross , due east to my yellow '?'.
     
  19. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Few pages from Sgt Rogers Day booklet.
    Points 51 & 57 mentioned.
    Anyone care to comment.
    I'm close but not 100% sure.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  20. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    Sergeant Maurice Albert Wyndham Rogers MM, 2nd Bn. The Wiltshire Regiment, 13 Inf Bde, 5 Div, 13 Corps.

    Awarded Immediate MM.

    At Gerbini, on 1st August 1943, the Carr- Pl and 7 Pl of 'A' Coy were detailed to carry out a recce in force of the enemy posistions in the Gerbini area.

    Sgt. Rogers was ordered to go forward with two carriers to the Farm Landolina.

    When Sgt. Rogers and the carriers were with 200 yards of the farm, enemy positions were encountered. Sgt. Rogers engaged the enemy with his LMG's, and the enemy retaliated. At this stage the track of Sgt. Rogers came off. Leaving his crew to engage the enemy, Sgt. Rogers returned to the Pl Comd with his second carrier, and gave a report of the exact position of the enemy; He then directed the fire of a 3" mortar, and brought effective fire to bear on the enemy positions. By this time, the enemy had brought up heavy mortars and were shelling the area in which the carriers and infantry were, but in spite of this, Sgt. Rogers went back to his broken down carrier. The order was given for the carriers to withdraw.

    Under heavy MG and Mortar fire, Sgt. Rogers fastened tow chains to his broken down carrier personally, and successfully towed it back out of the danger area. During this operation, two German 75mm Self Propelled Guns had come up and opened rapid fire into the carrier positions; undeterred, Sgt. Rogers continued in the slow process of towing his carrier, which was running only on one track, to safety.

    On reaching cover Sgt. Rogers showed great resource in locating a burnt out carrier and transferring the track from this onto his own carrier, thus rendering his carrier ready for action in the quickest possible time.

    Sgt. Rogers determination, coolness and resource in recovering his carrier under heavy enemy fire, and his complete disregard for his own personal safety was a splendid example to his platoon.


    LG 18.11.43
     

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