Royal Artillery Leonard Barker - help with service records please

Discussion in 'Service Records' started by fathippy, Jun 10, 2019.

  1. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    My grandfather Leonard Barker served in the RA from 1936 to 1942. During this time he was posted to India and then Egypt. he was discharged after losing an eye. Does anyone have any info about the RA during this time.

    thanks

    Julie
     
  2. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi,

    Welcome to the forum.

    Your best starting point would be to apply for his service records from MOD via this link -

    Get a copy of military service records

    The Royal Artillery was a massive organisation so you need to know which “unit” he served with before you can discover information at a “unit” level.

    Once you have his records members here will be able to assist you greatly.

    Steve
     
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  3. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    I have his records but cannot understand them.

    Help?
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

  5. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    Wow thank you. I'll get reading now.

    Thanks

    Julie
     
  6. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi,

    Thanks for attaching his papers. Did you receive any B103 forms from MOD? There may be several pages. They are the best forms from which to track a soldiers military history during WW2.

    He appears to have served with 58 Battery, 25th Field Regiment (part of 4th Indian Division) until he was injured on the Western Desert (not Dessert as spelled in the statement of service papers you’ve attached) in Egypt (possibly across the border into Libya) during the November/December 1941 Operation Crusader advance to relieve Tobruk.

    Now you know his unit you should make contact with members Drew5233 or PsyWar.Org (Lee). One of them ought to be able to source the unit War Diary for you so you will be able to discover his Battery whereabouts and activities.

    Good Luck

    Steve

    PS

    From the internet -

    25 Field Regiment during World War II

    25 Field Regiment fought in Africa as part of the 4th Indian Infantry Division. They took part in the East African Campaign, a series of battles fought in East Africa by the British and allies against Italian forces from june 1940 to november 1941. The 4th Indian Division fought in Egypt and took part in operation Compass in december 1940. The division was involved in the decisive battles of that campaign in the camps around Sidi Barrani. In december 1940 the division was rushed to British Sudan to join with the 5th Indian Infantry Division to prevent the Italian forces from threatening Red Sea supply routes to Egypt as well as Egypt and the Suez Canal itself.
    In june 1942 they were at the Gazala Line at Tobruk. On june 21 a battery of the regiment destroyed their guns and vehicles at the fortress of Tobruk. Four officers and 17 men avoided capture by the Afrika Korps of Rommel.

     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
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  7. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    Hi

    Are the b forms his application form? If so I have them.

    Julie
     
  8. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    There is a book on 25 Field Regt, R.A., but, alas, it covers the unit's later time in North-West Europe and is very slim at any rate.

    25th Field Regiment R.A. (Gale & Polden, 1948).
    25 Field Regiment were part of 4th Indian Division. This book will give you an overview of what the division was doing:

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/FOURTH-IND...dian+division&qid=1560266961&s=gateway&sr=8-1

    For specifics, I'd suggest consulting the unit's War Diaries for the period (some appear missing):

    Reference: WO 169/263
    Description: Royal Artillery: 25 Field Regiment (Fd Regt)
    Date: 1940 July - Dec.

    Reference: WO 169/2622
    Description: British Troops Sudan and Eritrea: Royal Artillery: 25 Field Regiment (Fd Regt RA)
    Date: 1941 Feb.- Apr.

    Reference: WO 169/1450
    Description: Royal Artillery: 25 Field Regiment (Fd Regt RA)
    Date: 1941 May- Dec.

    Reference: WO 169/4580
    Description: Royal Artillery: 25 Field Regiment (Fd Regt)
    Date: 1942 Jan.- May

    These documents will tell you where the unit was and what they were doing, but they are only available at the National Archives in Kew. If you are unable to go there in person, there are two members of this board who offer a paid copying service:

    http://ww2talk.com/index.php?members/drew5233.6786/
    http://ww2talk.com/index.php?members/psywar-org.2876/

    Both are highly recommended.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
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  9. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

  10. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi,

    The B103 is entitled Service & Casualty Form and the frontispiece contains much personal information drawn from portions of the Enlistment and Statement of Service from you’ve attached above.

    Here is an example of the “continuation” page of a B103.

    If you have any more papers that MOD sent you members will be able to assist in interpretation if you upload them to the forum.

    Steve

    EDIT TO ADD 6pm

    You've just added some B103 forms to your Sherratt topic:salut:
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
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  11. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    Hi
    No when I requested the info from mod only got the ones uploaded and his attestation forms ( at least that's what I think they are. They look like application forms).
     
  12. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    I know he served in India and Egypt as I have 2 photos of him. When he was injured he told my mum he had been put with the assumed dead but was somehow spotted and sent to hospital in Australia.
     
  13. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi,

    It’s not the first time that members have reported lack of B103 forms on service files provided by MOD.

    Other members have contacted MOD again to request a further search for the “missing” B103 forms and have been successful with MOD belatedly supplying them and apologising for the initial failure to copy them.

    On the other hand some members have not been successful with MOD reporting that the file doesn't contain any B103 forms. Likely been lost from the file over the past 70 odd years.

    You may want to contact MOD via the number on the covering letter provided with the service papers to request a further search for the B103 forms.

    Good Luck.

    Steve
     
  14. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi,

    MOD have a policy of not releasing any medical information with service files - unlike online Canada and Australia service files that do contain medical information and case notes. However B103 do usually include the names/number of medical facilities a man passed through.

    You may find some details of the medical establishments he passed through in the 25 Field Regiment War Diary. They usually contain details and locations in the weekly “field return” forms of men absent from the unit that they “desire to be returned”.

    When I visited U.K. National Archives some years ago I spotted details of an uncle’s locations when he was absent from his Field Regiment in Italy in 1944 in his unit WD. You now have an easier, and much less expensive, method of having sight of the WD via the look up and copy service provided by Drew & Lee I mentioned above (information repeated by Charley Fortnum in a post following mine).

    Steve
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
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  15. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    Hi

    After speaking to my dad about grandad he remembers he was in the cavalry in Jhansi in India. Apparently my uncle has photos of him with his horse. Dad remembers them getting Christmas cards for many years from a commanding officer called Emergency. Does any of this ring any bells with anyone?
     
  16. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi,

    There was a huge British army presence in India until 1947.

    There were also many “Cavalry” Regiments - they would likely have been predominantly “horsed” in the 1930’s before mechanisation but without the name of a specific unit further research could be difficult as there were twenty-one cavalry regiments in the British Indian Army at the commencement of the Second World War.

    If you have any pictures of him wearing a cap then a cap badge expert might be able to assist further in unit identification.

    You may appreciate the overview provided on this site -

    Documents – India 1930 - 1947 - British Military History

    Steve
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019
  17. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    I've several pics of him in India but they seem more recreational.
     

    Attached Files:

  18. harkness

    harkness Well-Known Member

    Royal Artillery Attestations 1883-1942:
    Barker.jpg
     
  19. fathippy

    fathippy Junior Member

    Sorry new to this what does this mean? That is definitely my grandfather.
     
  20. harkness

    harkness Well-Known Member

    Julie - it records your grandfather joining the RA (and allocates his Service Number).

    He appears to have been wounded on more than one occasion.

    British Army Casualty Lists 1939-1945:
    Barker_02.jpg


    Barker_01.jpg
     

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