Researching 12 RTR in BNAF

I'm researching my Grandfather's war. I have recently recieved copies of his War Record, including Service and Casualty Forms. It seems he was posted to the 12th RTR in July 1941, and remained with the 12 RTR until end of August 1943. If anyone has any war diaries from this period for the 12 RTR, and is willing to share, I'd be really grateful. I'm pretty new to all this, please forgive lapses in terminology, it will come in time.

As best as I can make out he left the UK on 12/3/1943 to join the BNAF with the 12 RTR. Then in Service Record style he's suddenly gone from the 12 RTR to the 77 Fd Rgt RA in August 1943. The big question for me is... what was going on for the 12 RTR between March 1943 and August 1943?

For any help I'd be grateful.

 

Wiki refers to the 12th RT as part of the 21st Brigade for the period you asked about:

Link: 21st Army Tank Brigade (United Kingdom) - Wikipedia

They were involved in the final push into Tunisia and I have found two dead who are buried at: Search Results | CWGC

Namely: David George Woods, 7932316 and Charlie Hume Lockhart, 7948845 who died April and May 1943.

One incident is recorded:

From: Tunis Battlefield Pickup Map. Operation Strike May 6 1943 and Operation Vulcan

Searching the CWGC records might help your quest.

 

Thank you for the direction, that's much appreciated.

 

Hi

Could we have his full name and service number? And what corps was he in during the war?

A 'tankie' (RAC/RTR) moving from a RTR to a RA unit would be somewhat unusual.

But a person from the RAOC, RASC or REME would not be so, as RTR units had a massive support network keeping the tanks going.

Hope this helps

Gus

 

Thanks. According to the front sheet of his Service and Casualty Form he was variously detailed as:

Corps
Royal Tank Corps Depot
ACC (Army Catering Corps)
Unit
5th Bm
6th Bm
17/21st Lancers
[illegible] Royal [illegible] Regt.

On 12/3/43 his record shows "Embarked UK" and his unit was "ACC att 12RTR".
On 17/7/43 the ACC att was gone and his unit was just listed "12RTR".
On 28/8/43 his record states "p.a. to 77 fd Regt RA" which remained his unit until the end of the War.

Also wondering what the following would mean:

Posted X(ii) on adm to 5 [illegible] 17/7/43
Trans from 5 [illegible] to 76 - - 20/7/43
Dis 76 [illegible] to 12RTR 31/7/43

I understand after the Tunis campaign there was need to rebuild the Tank regiment and so they were hanging around a bit. Is it likely that in the reorganisation some troopers were moved around for the Italy campaign?

 

Hi

With so much illegible it might be better if you post the records here and let us have a look for ourselves.

Gus

 

Thanks,

Posted X(ii) on adm to 5 [illegible] 17/7/43
Trans from 5 [illegible] to 76 - - 20/7/43
Dis 76 [illegible] to 12RTR 31/7/43

View here:
SaCFp1.png

Illegible.png

 

Gen(eral) Hosp(ital) is my reading of the 5 & 76

 

Hi

As AB64 says. It's Gen Hosp

More info here . Hospitals WW2 - Scarlet Finders

Gus

 

Findmypast has his entry from the RTR enlistment record which has a note transferred to Army Catering Corps 18/4/42

 

Thank you, that is absolutely fascinating. So he was transferred from 12RTR to hospital in 2 locations, and then transferred back to 12RTR where he remained until 28/8/43.
I've no idea why he was in hospital, it was some time after Vulcan. Illness perhaps?

 

That's right. He was in Wivenhoe and then Cumnock before being attached to the ACC training centre in Aldershot in May 42. On his record the transfer to the ACC is back dated to 18/4/42 further down the sheet. He ceased to be attached to Aldershot at the end of May 42. The record shows his unit as ACC att 12RTR from then until he Embarked in March 43 when it reverts to just 12RTR. It's not mentioned again until after he's transferred away from 12RTR to 77th Fd. Rgt. RA in August 43 when he's mustered as a Tradesman Cook.

I have no idea what any of this means in terms of what he was doing day to day. I've got a lot to learn about how all this works.

 

Hi

FMP does not list him as ever being a casualty, so his hospital stays were more than likely down to sickness.

Gus

 

Yes, ACC. So that makes more sense.

 

After the Axis surrendered in Tunisia the 1st Army was disbanded. Most of the Units were transferred to the 8th Army. There was a period of reorganisation where training was organised in readiness for other theatres mainly for Italy, which raised many difficulties. The 8th Army, mainly being motorised and equipped for fighting on flat ground, had to address the problem of fighting in the mountains.
Montgomery was in need of experienced mountain infantry so took in the 78th Division The British 1st Division was left in Tunisia as the 51st Highland Division was given their relatively new transport while 1st Div carried out further mountain training in the area around Djebel Ressas, awaiting replacement vehicles which took months to arrive. They went to Italy in December 1943 transferring to the American 5thArmy for the Anzio Landings in January 1944.
The 4th Division also spent time in Tunisia before moving to Italy in February 1944 where they became involved in the fighting in the hills for Monte Casino and later on the Gothic Line.
8th Army was rich in armour but the Italian terrain was not tank friendly due to narrow mountain roads and flooded rivers on the plains. 8th Army stayed to advance on the east coast where they could use their motorised transport and armour but in land it was an infantry war with artillery support, where supplies were often carried by mule.
4th Division was mainly employed in the hills and mountains before being sent to Greece where the gunners were used as infantry.

77 (Highland) Field Regiment RA(TA) - The Royal Artillery 1939-45
1st Renfrew and Dumbarton Artillery Volunteers - Wikipedia

 

I have started a conversation with you regarding the war diary for the 12th Royal Tank Regiment.

 

Thank you so much. This is just wonderful.

 

Thanks to dryan67 for the War Diary for 12RTR. I've been able to convert it to PDF and have it recognise the text so it's easier to search for names, places and words. If it's any help others can download it here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/13yEvHSbePYPdiMb_SziXe_ruZtJ3VXqM/view?usp=sharing

Thanks again everyone. You're a great help to this beginner.

 

Hello. I have not been on this site for a long time and was just looking for a post I had read several years ago. My father was in 12RTR and arrived in Tunisia in March 1943. He was in the battle at Cactus Farm on April 27th and I have done quite a bit of research around this particular event and have visited the battle location in Tunisia. I also copied some materials from the National Archives as there is a very detailed account of the 12RTR events in April/May 1943. Happy to connect with anyone who has, or is looking for, information around this time.