Hi, I thought I would post some source material regarding this as I think some doubt has been cast here on whether it occurred. The following is from WO 204/7417 Italy - Anti-tank units organisation 1944-1945 and I would be happy to share the file if anyone is interested. This is only a selection from the file. November 1944:
Thanks for posting this - lots of information there! I knew about Deacons being converted to Ammo carriers in NWE, never seen evidence that any were used in Italy though, if 3rd line workshops had the necessary drawings, conversions could also have been done in N Africa. Did 8 Army take any Deacons to Sicily, either as SP or ammo carriers. I don't think all the N African Deacons were sent to Turkey - but I've never delved into the life of Deacons. My times at Kew are limited to a few days a year if I'm lucky and I usually have a list of files that I think I need to copy as fast as I can that I can bring home to plough through at leisure! Bit hit & miss but Oz is a long way from home and I fall down too many rabbit in any case. cheers.
Hi Christian, I wish I had answers for you! But I'm afraid I don't know. It seems like it would really take copying all the anti-tank regiment war diaries of the divisions sent to Sicily (assuming they were issued on a divisional scale). I've never heard of it though.
I wish, too. But you never know, there's stuff hidden away in that damned archive we haven't un-earthed yet!
From the information I have on my site (this may not be complete), the following ATk Regts were in Sicily: 52 with 5 Div, 58 with 46 Div, 61 with 51 Div, 64 with 78 Div, 73 with 8 Army, 102 with 50 Div and 105 with 8 Army. I have the relevant War Diaries for all of these except 58 ATk. 73 and 105 both with 8 Army, presumably Corps units, both had Deacon. The only other Deacon units I know of are 76 and 84 ATk Regts. Neither of these went to Sicily. When I get chance I will see if the diaries have anything to add. Derek
I wonder whether 73rd or 105th's war diaries mention the Deacons being withdrawn from the regiments, and if so, when.
Scanning through 73rd's diary, only mention so far is 3 new Deacons collected by 234 Bty in Feb 43. Up to June so far, might have to finish it tomorrow.
Preparing to leave Sicily, 73 ATk Regt issued Admin Instruction No. 1 on 15/10/43. This gave a warning order that all guns would be handed in on the 20th October prior to embarkation. It further stated that all Deacons would be handed in to Vehicle (42) Park at Misterbianca. I'll check 105's diaries later.
No mention whatsoever of Deacons in 105 ATk's diaries. The Regt was only formed in Dec 42 so the 1943 Diaries cover their formation and through Sicily and into Italy. The first 6 months of the diaries are fairly detailed on the comings and goings of the guns and vehicles. There are several mentions of 6 pdrs and Pheasants but no mention of Deacon. Given the amount of detail I would be very surprised if they had Deacons but not mentioned them. Seems like the information on 105th having them, on my site, must be duff. I will need to look into this further.
Thanks for this - good to know the id of a regiment that had Pheasants, plenty of photos but rarely mentioning user regiments. I missed your earlier post - 234 Bty drawing 3 new Deacons and then the regiment being ordered to hand them to a vehicle park at Misterbianca which is inland of Catania proved beyond any doubt that there were Deacons in Sicily. Totally new to me. Great stuff!
Here are the vehicle & gun in & outs for 105 ATk. Note Christian, that some Pheasants were passed to 102 ATk. January 43 New vehicles issued: 1 x Ford Utility, 4 x Dodge 3 Ton, 6 x Dodge 15 cwt, 1 x Bantam, 4 x Triumph M/C's, 11 Ford type Portees. 1 x Reconditioned Bedford Water Truck. 209 Bty from 84 ATk joined the Regt bringing 16 x 6 pdr Guns. Q Bty 95 ATk joined as B Bty with 4 x 6 pdr Guns & 12 2 pdr Guns. The 2 pdrs were soon swapped for 6 pdrs. March 43 Issued: 14 x 15 cwt GS, 5 x 3 ton GS, 1 x Dodge Breakdown vehicle, 12 x 3 ton Portees, 1 x 15 cwt W/T, 1 x 3 ton Breakdown, 1 x 3 ton Water Truck, 5 x M/C's. 7 x 15 cwt W/T for the Signals Section. 314 Bty joined with 4 x 6 pdr Guns & 8 x 2 pdr Guns. April 43 4 x 6 pdr guns handed in. Issued: 1 x Norton M/C, 1 x Ford Utility Staff car, 10 Morris FA Tractors & 12 Chicks, 4 x Pheasant Mk I, 15 x Pheasant Mk II & 18 Chicks, 4 x Morris FA Tractors, 1 x Guy FA Tractor. May 43 13 x FA Tractors sent to 52 ATk. 2 x 6 pdr Guns to 4 Free French Brigade. 1 x 15 cwt GS, 1 x 6 pdr Gun returned. Issued: 1 x AOP, 7 x Pheasants, 2 x 15 cwt W/T, 6 x FA Tractors, 1 x 3 Ton GS. 2 x 15 cwt W/T to 66 Med Rgt. 3 Ton Recovery to 24 Fld Rgt. 6 x Willys Batams to 3 Survey Rgt. 4 x Pheasants to 102 ATk Rgt. July 43 Issued: 4 x M/C's, 3 x Ford 3 Ton GS, 1 x Morris 30 cwt, 1 x Chev FA Tractor. Handed in: 1 x Ford Portee, 1 x Ford 3 Ton GS, 1 x Chev Portee, 1 x Chev 15 cwt GS, 1 x Morris FA Tractor. Does anyone know what the "Chicks" were. My best guess would be Trailer Arty No.27 modified to carry the 17 pdr ammo.
