PROBLEMS WITH CATERPILLAR D8s IN NORMANDY.

Dave you're too kind ...

I suspect the dozers depicted in the video are not those operated by a IWT unit? Oddly I came across this more relevant pic in a photo collection, which turned out to be from IWM.

"A bulldozer being used to recover a Cromwell tank that became bogged down on the beach, 14 June 1944."

(I can't help with the signal scenes, but there is more info on the Grant video here. It might be a good place to pose that question.)

Regards ...

 

Thanks for that, Mike.

Pic. 3 would be a PBR then. This one is named Marjorie.

Does TID stand for anything?

Jane

 

Jane,

Yes PBR and LBV are almost identical but one used by the Navy and one by IWT.

I cant find information about TIDs on this forum but Google will show you some. I will also search my untidy files.

Mike

 

Here are some photos of my Dad, Jim Walsh, during his time with the IWT and also much later during anniversary visits to old haunts.

As well as Richard Fisher some names from those days are McSween(ey) who was a Thames lighterman, Donald Millar from Greenock and Jimmy Welsh from Newport Wales.

Pic.1 - Ostend 1944

Pic.2 - Jim on far right Antwerp 1945

Pic.3 - Jim on left

Pic.4 - Jim in Holland (I think)

Pic.5 - Jim and Dick Fisher 5/6/2004 Peace Garden Caen after an unexpected encounter


Please can anyone identify the craft?

Welcome to the forum.

It is really interesting to see Photos 1 - 4 (especially having previously seen No 5 some years ago!).

You have quite a good collection. If you have your Dad's service record possibly you could summarise what you feel is appropriate and post this as a thread of its own? A 'timeline' would be a good idea. Even if you did not want to publish this it would be useful for your own family reference.

 

Jane,

I hope I have attached a couple of pictures of TIDS including one working with PBRs in Mulberry B.


View attachment TID Tugs.docx

Mike

 

As part of my research into Diesel Locos in use by the WD
I came across this photo.

http://www.stichting162.nl/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/D-day-landing.jpg

 

Wow! You know so much. And I'm so grateful for this. I wish I had found this site sooner when my Dad was still alive: he would have loved it.

Here are some notes I made of my Dad's recollection of PBR's.

"The Port of London Authority was based in the Tower of London and we came under their auspices. Togged up in wellingtons and oilskin coats we were on lighters which were being adapted with engines (port and starboard) and ramps. A cabin was fitted out with table, bed, water tank and Canadian stove. It was obvious that these (PBR's) were being prepared for beach landings. A civilian tug took 4 at a time to the other side of Richmond to be adapted. We returned at the end of the day on the tug and were dropped off at Richmond for the underground to Tower Hill. We were staying in the Tower of London and had to be back before the Ceremony of the Keys. The catering was good, though."

 

Ploughman,

A nice picture showing the stress that these tractors were put under. Since you don't say I will add that it is Gold Beach and shows two Caterpillar D8 Recovery Tractors from a Beach Recovery Section REME. You can also just see a waterproofed version of this tractor following.

The loco is of course the cute little WD 150hp 0-4-0 diesel shunter. The trailer is one designed using Orolo tracks to be towed by a Churchill ARV to recover tanks.

Mike

 

Jane,

I am far too modest to think that your kind comments refer only to me. I must say that most of what I know has been gleaned from material or leads sent to me by members of the forum.

I must also point out that the information you have is of great value and interest. Please do share it as time allows.

Mike.

 

Ritsonvaljos, I believe we did meet on the WW2 blog.

Dad did start to recite his wartime memories to me but we got to Normandy then he became ill and we weren't able to continue so I only have the odd anecdote but not the date or context for the rest of the war.

I could, I suppose, summarise what I have got. There's quite a tale as he was a regular in the R.A. at the outbreak of war.

Jane

 

Ploughman,

A nice picture showing the stress that these tractors were put under. Since you don't say I will add that it is Gold Beach and shows two Caterpillar D8 Recovery Tractors from a Beach Recovery Section REME. You can also just see a waterproofed version of this tractor following.

The loco is of course the cute little WD 150hp 0-4-0 diesel shunter. The trailer is one designed using Orolo tracks to be towed by a Churchill ARV to recover tanks.

Mike

Slight variation with the detail I have from the site were I found the photo.
It says on there that two locos were landed on Juno beach and two more on Utah beach.
stichting 162 restauratie diesellocomotief ns serie 160

 

I will check my references. I had it in my mind that I had read about it in the report of 104 Beach Sub Area which was Gold. I have probably misread or made an incorrect inference.

The Beach Recovery Sub Section boasted that they were called in to land the loco and trailer when the unit which was to have unloaded them failed.

Mike

 

Ploughman,

You are quite correct of course. I have not found the report but I have found the photograph on the IWM site and the caption says Courseulles which is Juno. This makes sense since the railway line is within yards of the beach at the main beach exit in use at this date. 26th July.

Thank you.

Mike

 

I was wondering about the star on the bonnet of the D8
Any relevance?

 

Stars were the standard recognition sign for Allied vehicles in NW Europe. Plain stars on front and sides, star in a circle on top for air recognition. Locomotives often had the star in a circle on the cab top. Not obvious in most photos.

Mike

 

Here is one on the beaches of Normandy 65 years after it could well have driven onto the same surface.

Also some shots of a couple of Caterpillars at The War & Peace Show in 2011.





Scott

 

Lovely pictures of D8s. These were impressive and powerful machines. The thumbnail shows the heavy winches as used on the recovery version and the air recognition star.

These were in fact the standard heavy recovery vehicle used by REME. Armoured units had ARV versions of tanks but without winch. Winch equipped ARV2 were late arrivals and very rare. The only drawback with the D8 was that it had to be transported to the recovery site on a trailer towed by a 4 X 4 or 6 X 6 tractor. It also needed a Loyd Carrier to carry the assorted recovery gear (earth anchors, pulleys, snatch blocks etc).

Mike

 

Takes me back to my days at Chattendene in 1979 round and round the field dragging an Onion Box scraper and trying not to fall off the side of the bund.

 

Here is the flag of the I.W.T.

 

I have found some information about the problems with Caterpillar tractors in the REME history of WWII. There is a section commenting on the reliability or otherwise of all types of equipment.

It states that unit maintenance was hindered by a lack of user manuals. Workshops were hindered by a lack of manuals, spare part lists and spare parts. This fits with war diaries which say that machines were either laying untouched in workshops or that workshops would not accept them since they could not repair them.

Armoured tractors and dozers were held up in workshops because the armoured body had to be removed for most tasks and suitable cranes to lift them were in short supply. They needed to lift 3 tons to a height of 14 foot.

Mike