There shouldn't be confusion though as the uniform insignia and the position of it easily identifies Heer or Waffen SS. One of the other problems is that SS Auflarungs Abteilungs ( Recce Bn ) , Panzerjager Abt ( Anti Tank ) and even Panzer Artillerie units also wore the black Panzer wrap so they might not be Panzer crews at all Only the colour of the Waffenarbe can help to tell the difference. regards Paul
Hi, All good stuff like it has been stated they would have swopped their uniforms around some wearing army blouses others SS and what about the Grey wrap overs that the artillery and self propelled crews wore? Heres a few pics to illustrate not only the insignia but the cut hope its of some use. SS BLACK and SS GREY(Artillery) without insignia SS ARTILLERY UNITS and SS PEA PATTERN HEER VERSION and SS GERMAN For a short time around 1939/1940, some armed SS formations reportedly used "double" collar insignia, i.e. pairs of patches that did not display the wearer's rank on the left side, but which bore on both sides either the death's head (for the Totenkopf formations) or the Sigrunen (for other formations). SS SKULLS AND PANZER COLLAR INSIGNIA(Pink Pipping) Good selection of Dress and insignia on display Hope this can help with regards to points of reference Regards Verrieres
That Camo pattern James, was that issued to all SS tankers or for a campaign such as Normandy only? That SS-Erbsenmuster was begun in 1943 and stockpiled for widespread issue to all branches (and all fronts) the following year, dave.
Towards the end of the war the uniform of the Panzer crew could result in all the crew having a different style of Uniform, due to shortages etc, plus fashion! Regards Tom
Towards the end of the war the uniform of the Panzer crew could result in all the crew having a different style of Uniform, due to shortages etc, plus fashion! Regards Tom So there is the possibility of different crew members having various types of Panzer uniform??? Wow! They werent really that useful for winter fighting though!!!
I am sure that I have a picture in a book showing this point. When I find it I will post it. Regards Tom
Verrieres photo shows officers from the Das Reich Division Sturmgeschutz ( Assault Gun ) Abteilung including the commander of 2 Batterie Oakleaves winner Ernst August Krag, here he has the rank of SS Hauptsturmfuhrer. The grey Wrap was also worn by both Panzerjager and Self propelled Artillery crews. regards Paul
The attached photograph comes from the book; Kampf und Untergang der deutschen Panzertruppe 1939-1945. The caption says; The combat forces (Tanks and Panzer Grenadiers) are dependent on close co-operation in action. By the end of the war there was little uniformity in German Military dressing. Black and fieldgrey on the same man, sidecaps and peaked field caps being worn by the members of one tank crew. Lack of supplies but also fashion were the reasons for this. Regards Tom
So there is the possibility of different crew members having various types of Panzer uniform? By the later war it looks to have been as much of a probability as a possibility. I seem to recall that the German short jacket was inspired/copied from Tommy Atkins's gear? Something about Kriegsmarine being directly issued with captured British Jackets too?? Would need to check that though. Dave, I know you've got a few little 'bits and pieces' - have you got any examples of Panzer uniform you might care to dust off and share with us? Cheers, Adam.
I remember a discussion about the black panzer uniform being so coloured because of the practicalities of such colour. Black doesnt show up oil etc and doesnt look quite so dirty.