Northumberland Hussars - Ellis Race 1134883

Discussion in 'Searching for Someone & Military Genealogy' started by Belly, Jan 12, 2009.

  1. Buteman

    Buteman 336/102 LAA Regiment (7 Lincolns), RA


    I know there is a slight gap, but could it be "granted permission"

  2. Belly

    Belly Engage the enemy more closely

    Still not sure, I've been told that "Allce" is a common abbreviation for "Allowance", my thoughts are:

    Granted Administration Allowance
    Granted Admission Allowance
    Granted Dominion Allowance

    The period it refers to covers his time on the troop ship travelling from Durban to Egypt, so it must be some kind of allowance to cover that journey?

    The other line could be:

    Granted WPP
    Granted WFP
    Granted WRP
    Granted WFF

    Or the "W" could be "to"?

    No idea?!
  3. Bdr Connor

    Bdr Connor Junior Member

    Hello every one

    Im trying to trace my grandfathers service history i have his discharge paperwork, which says he was in the 102 (NH) Anti Tank regiment Royal Artillery, which has so far led me to this thread,

    i have read the thread and the regimental history from ramical was very interesting.
    unfortunatly i dont know what battery he was,
    does any one know how i go about getting his service history records? and where from.

    I am a serving Bdr in 4th Regiment Royal Artillery and so all this interests me quite alot unfortunatly i never met my grandad he died in march 1986 and i wasnt born until September that year.

    any help will be greatly appreceated
  4. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

  5. Buteman

    Buteman 336/102 LAA Regiment (7 Lincolns), RA

    Hi & Welcome

    If you telephone 0141 - 224 2670 and ask for forms to be sent, that is the quickest way to get the right ones. They'll ask you some questions and post them to you direct. It costs £30 and takes 9 - 12 months to process your completed application.

    I have the book on the NH and will look through it for any reference to your Grandfather.

    Regards - Rob
  6. Bdr Connor

    Bdr Connor Junior Member

    Thanks very much gents,

    I have 3 of his medals but my mam says she remembers him having alot more but thinks her older sister took them and unfortunatly she died about 10 years ago so not much hope of getting those back.
    but the ones i have are the itay star and the 1939 -45 star and also a round medal again for 1939 - 45 i presumed the 2 39 - 45 medals were presented to everyone who served between those dates.

    i will get on to my remaining aunty asap and ask if she can dig out any more info as she lives in the house that was my grandads hopefully get some pics and more info.

    thanks again
  7. Buteman

    Buteman 336/102 LAA Regiment (7 Lincolns), RA

    You'll find out which medals he was awarded from his service records.
  8. Bdr Connor

    Bdr Connor Junior Member

    Thanks rob

    Ive managed to piece together abit more info about my grandad from the medals i have and from speaking to family, i now now that he served in egypt and my aunty says she remembers that he spoke of working with the ghurkas, also i found out he was in the TA before the NH became a Artillery regiment.

    The medals i have are the 1939 - 45 star and the 1939 - 45 war medal, however the ribbons on these medals didnt match the correct ones, so i done some digging to find out what medals they were from, and found that i have the ribbon for the france,germany, holland star and also the ribbon from a TA efficiancy medal. the other ribbon i have is from the world war 1 war medal 1914 - 18 aka the squeak. which would of been my great grandfathers medal.

    so judging from the history of the NH you put up all this fits into place.
    I have requested his service records so now just have to wait to have everything confirmed and hopefully more details about which BTY he was in.
    Also my aunty has some photos that she is going to dig out for me so hopefully they will bring up some details like the ones of ellis race did.

    thanks for the help and i will keep updates coming when i find out more .

  9. Buteman

    Buteman 336/102 LAA Regiment (7 Lincolns), RA


    The service number of your Grandfather is not that of a Northumberland Hussar original, but of Royal Artillery origin. They brought in a number of RA recruits because of their experience, so the service record should tell you when he joined them. It would be useful to find out the battery number as while they were in the Middle East in 1942, they were split up and attached to support different field and Royal Horse Artillery Regts units for a while before being reunited under the 102 (NH) Anti-Tank command.

    Do you also have any evidence that he served in Greece & Crete? A large number of men were captured in Crete and they had to bring in a large number of RA men to bring the Regt back up to strength.

    Regards - Rob
  10. Belly

    Belly Engage the enemy more closely

    Welcome aboard, I’ve got a quite a bit of info now on the Northumberland Hussars, please keep us posted with your research, we’d love to discover what you find out, especially pictures if you have any, not many pics of Noodles seem to exist!

    Good Luck
  11. Belly

    Belly Engage the enemy more closely

    A few of my latest findings:

    General Sir Bernard Montgomery addressing the men of 50th Division before decorating them for gallantry during the Normandy landings.
    General Sir Bernard Montgomery addressing the men of 50th Division before decorating them for gallantry during the Normandy landings. IWM Ref: TR 2013

    Clearly see the Noodle sat in the foreground, close up here:

  12. Belly

    Belly Engage the enemy more closely

    And another one, IWM Ref: TR 2012

    Close up:

  13. Belly

    Belly Engage the enemy more closely


    If your grandfather served throughout then I expect his medals will be as per Ellis':

    Left to right:
    1939-45 Star
    Africa Star (with 8th Army Bar)
    Italy Star
    France & Germany Star
    War Medal
    (Could have defence medal if served in the UK first?)

  14. Bdr Connor

    Bdr Connor Junior Member

    Thanks for the updates gents, ive not been on for a week or so ive got the forms through to apply for the service records, just waiting on family to dig out my grandads death certificate before i get them sent off!.

    but i will keep all updates coming as i get any.

    thanks martin
  15. Steve Mac

    Steve Mac Very Senior Member

    Hello Paul,

    The border county from which I hail is called Northumberland. Northumbria is the Anglo-Saxon Kingdon, which stretched from the Trent to the Tweed (and at one time in the 9th century included most of SE Scotland up to the Forth).

    Most people think that the 'TT' stands for 'Tyne Tees', but it could indeed be 'Trent Tweed'; however, the former is most likely for the 1939 to 1945 - 50th (Northumbrian) Division.

    The 51st (Highland) Division, which had a large 'HD' shoulder patch, were known as the 'Highway Decorators' and the 50th (Northumbrian) 'TT' Division as the 'Town Titivators'; but Tom (Canning) once said that the 'TT' covered a few less polite names - all banter of course.

    The permanent Infantry Brigades in 50 Div in WWII were the 69th, 150th and 151st. The 151st was made up of 6th, 8th and 9th Battalions, Durham Light Infantry. However, the 69th (joined June 1940) was 5th Bn East Yorkshire Regiment, and 6th and 7th Bns Green Howards and the 150th (destroyed/captured at Gazala June 1942) was 4th Bn East Yorkshire Regiment, 4th and 5th Bn's Green Howards.

    The East Yorks were originally from Hull and the East Riding. The Green Howards were originally from North and East Yorks. All then part of Yorkshire.

    So, your wife's Yorkshireman grandfather served with a lot of fellow Tykes. But as I tell my wife and her parents - all from Yorkshire - they are all really Northumbrians; that goes down like a lead balloon... I say the same to a brother in law that hails from Kelso, Scottish Borders; but I won't repeat what he says in return. :D

    Anyway, your dad served with a very good Division in the 50th. I beleive I am right in saying that the 15th Div didn't serve overseas until post D-Day, but they had a good reputation from their time in NW Europe.


    Last edited: Jan 21, 2019
  16. Belly

    Belly Engage the enemy more closely

    You’re dead right Steve, in fact they do say that not only does the double T represent the Tyne and Tees but its also when viewed on its side supposed to represent the H for the Humber.

    50 Div was disbanded in December 44, and the Noodles moved to the 15th Scottish until they were finally disbanded in November 46.

    See story below from the Kiel Journal Saturday November 23rd 1946:
  17. Steve Mac

    Steve Mac Very Senior Member

    Hello Paul,

    The side viewing is indeed supposed to represent the 'H' for Humber and that would be appropriate, but I have never been able to see it; possibly a lack of imagination on my part! Or could it be my eyes??? I will have to defer reading the Kiel Journal until later - I need a magnifying glass (the 'zoom' facility on the computer only blurrs the words)...B)


    Last edited: Jan 21, 2019
  18. Belly

    Belly Engage the enemy more closely

    I know what you mean I always thought it was a bit tenuous! PM me your email address and I’ll email full res versions if you like

  19. Steve Mac

    Steve Mac Very Senior Member

    Hello Paul - PM sent!


  20. noodle

    noodle Junior Member

    The Northumberland Hussars where given the Freedom of Newcastle 40 years ago, on October 8th 2011 they took up their right to paraded through the city, my father took part in this parade and he was the only ww11 veteran on parade he is in his 92 year and did very well as the pace was not slow.

    He is half way down the last section of men on the side of the cam and has a walking stick.

    northumberland hussars 8/10/11 - YouTube

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