North African recollections

Discussion in 'North Africa & the Med' started by kingarthur, Jul 4, 2010.

  1. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    Are there any veterans on the forum that have any recollections of Tunis and Algiers during the early 40's?

    Thanks Day
     
  2. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    I am sure that Tom Canning will be in touch with you when he reads your post.

    Regards
    Tom
     
  3. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    Thanks Smudger,I just need some first hand descriptive knowledge for the back drop of my book,authenticity is a must for me.

    Regards

    Dave
     
  4. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    Tom is online and hopefully see your post quickly.

    Regards
    Tom
     
  5. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    KIngarthur
    The first British troops in Algiers got there in November 1942 - and Tunis in around the early part of May in 1943 -so it would be extremely difficult to describe those cities in 1940 - but I can say that Tunis smelled much better than Algiers as the stench of that city reached out to us when we were hove to about five miles out - as both Ron and I had the same thoughts on that stench
    Cheers
     
  6. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    Hi Tom

    I should of worded my question a bit better than saying early 40's.The actual period that I was interested in was indeed Nov 42 up until the time of the invasion of Sicily.

    Cheers

    Dave
     
  7. Ron Goldstein

    Ron Goldstein WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Dave

    As has been already pointed out to you, Algiers & then eventually, Tunis came much later.

    I wrote my own recollections on the BBC site:

    Some memories in life stick more than others, and one such memory was my first sight and smell of Africa. As soon as I could get up on deck after docking I was hit by the immense bright light of the sun hitting the white-washed houses along the coastal strip. This, when coupled with the green of the hills, the blue of the sea and sky and the completely alien smell drifting out from the land, was something completely outside my experience and was a fitting start to my wartime overseas experience.
    I remember very well the march to the transit area in full kit and in the blazing sun.


    Full story here:
    BBC - WW2 People's War - Algiers, April 1943, Our first sight of Africa
     
  8. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    Thanks for that Ron very kind of you.


    Dave
     
  9. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    KIngarthur -
    Not a problem as Ron has pointed out - I too finished at Cap Matifou for a few days and my time in the actual city of Algiers was merely a one night stand on guard at the docks - where the smell was even worse - and we had a commando with us who managed to steal the Officers dinner - which we enjoyed before moving out to Bone where I joined the regiment until moving to Italy after a week's leave in Tunis. My next spot of leave was in Naples for one whole day - then Rome many months later !
    Cheers
     
  10. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    Thanks Tom,the officers dinner caper made me smile,excellent
     
  11. PsyWar.Org

    PsyWar.Org Archive monkey

    Nothing too exciting here but might be useful for background, from my Grandfather's memoirs:

    The SS “Cuba” arrived at Algiers on 23rd March and 225 disembarked and then marched 11 miles to a location named “Gare-De-Constantine”. On this march the 225 met the first American troops they had ever seen and were not at all impressed. The Americans in a large column were overtaken by the 225, who were moving in the same direction, they appeared to be a shambles, walking along in a carefree manner with no purpose in mind, what a contrast to the 225 who despite being cramped on a ship for 11 days were marching in step and feeling the effects of the warm climate.

    During a halt for a ten minute break the OC purchased a sack of oranges and distributed them amongst the men. During the next few days the Company vehicles arrived from Algiers, also stores and equipment. The whole Company was inoculated against Typhus and a warning order issued to move to area Souk-Ahras, in Tunisia. April 1st saw the Company move off on a journey of 105 miles to Ben-Mansour, leaving there at 0630 hours on the 2nd for Am-El-Bey a journey of 170 miles and arriving at 1830 hours.

    Some difficulties were experienced on this move with several of the vehicles fitted with Ford V8 Engines: during the long climb into the Atlas mountains, the engines became rather hot causing evaporation of petrol due to the petrol pump being fitted at the rear between the V of the engine, but all the vehicles arrived under their own power. The following day, April 3rd the Company travelled to Guelma moving off at 0700 hours and arriving at 1200 hours a journey of 80 miles, the next day saw a further move of 90 miles arriving at Ghardimaou at l800 hours thus making a total journey of 445 miles in 4 days. On the 5th every man had a second Typhus injection. The CRE, Lt Col Foley, visited the Company on the 6th and placed them under the command of 21st Tank Brigade pending the arrival of 7th Field Company from Bone where they had been landed from the ship convoy and were not yet mobile.

    General Alexander now took over command of the Army Group which included the British 1st, 4th & 78th Divisions as well as USA 1st Infantry Division and was reorganising the Group for an all out attack from Medjez-El-Bab to Tunis, the Americans would be to the North, the British in the centre and on their right French troops who were in contact with the 8th Army. The 225 made a further move on the 8th and arrived in the Beja area during the night. When daylight came the town of Beja could be seen in the distance, this must have seen bitter fighting during the previous months and before its capture by the 1st Army, not one building had escaped damage and the few trees in sight were broken and bare.

    The Company were now in support of the 12th Infantry Brigade, 3 Section commanded by Lt K. Severn constructed a road and when completed was named “The Severn Road”. 2 Section were attached to the Royal Fusiliers. Lt McKay and 20 other ranks were sent on a mine-warfare course to be trained in the methods adopted by the 8th Army when clearing minefields. Captain White was posted to an Army Field Company. One Sapper was wounded whilst examining an unexploded bomb in a minefield on the 12th. Bish, the dog had to be put down, he had caught an infection and his condition had deteriorated, it was agreed that a battlefield was no place for a dog.


    Lee
     
  12. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    Thanks for that Lee, nice read.

    Tom,both yourself and Ron mention the smell,but what did it smell off?
     
  13. Ron Goldstein

    Ron Goldstein WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    what did it smell of?


    I suppose I could raise a laugh by saying "Don't ask !" but I believe you want a sensible answer so here goes, but remember, we are talking of memories of 67 years ago.

    It was a stong almost acrid smell that literally reached us from the shore which must have been about half a mile away

    Spices ?.... almost certainly.

    Manure, spread on crops?....... most probably

    Rotting vegetation ? ....... who knows

    All I know is that I can conjure it up even today and I had never encountered it before or come across it since.

    We've had a thread on the forum about the smell of Geman military positions, it looks like we've got one now on the smell of Algiers :)

    Ron
     
  14. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    The smells of World War II would make an excellent thread title.lol
     
  15. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Kingarthur -
    At that time we had to force down the usual Bully beef stew in 95% weather - and so this Welsh ex Commando felt that "something" should be done about the food - so he did - and stole the Officers dinners - which went down very easily - unfortuntely on finishing a guard at Naples Docks during which he went 'walkabout" and came back with new uniforms - and as there were no takers - he dressed in his NEW uniform and the Sergeant Major thought the Canadian uniform was extremly interesting and invited him for a short talk in his office - we never did see MacDonald again...
    Cheers
     
  16. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    KIngarther -
    The smells of Algiers is amisnomer - it should be the STENCH of Algiers - Ron is being quite polite in his description - but quite frankly it was seemingly a total absence of a sewerage system since the days of Augustine of Hippo - mixed with that of minature donkeys dying from overwork and being left on the streets , for the buzzards to clear in their own time- it was appalling !

    One chap survived many months there in the Pay corps and he wrote about Algiers extensively for the BBc series - can't think of his name at the moment but he then wrote again extensively of his explorations of various cities - Naples -Rome -Florence- he had Danish wife as I recall - and missed her terribly ! - but then who didnt miss their families...
    Cheers
     
  17. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    Great story Tom,these are everyday non military tales you never read about. There must be countless numbers of similar story's of stroke pulling and larking about, in what was a very serious and stressful time for you all.

    Cheers

    Dave
     
  18. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    My god,the smell was that bad,its making my guts turn at the very thought.
     
  19. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

  20. kingarthur

    kingarthur Well-Known Member

    Thanks for digging that out Tom
     

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