Non-combatant occupations

Discussion in 'Searching for Someone & Military Genealogy' started by charlottesarah, Jun 15, 2021.

  1. Hi all, I am doing family research for an elderly relative in Suffolk, but I am in Australia so you will have to bear with my limited knowledge. We are looking for a male family member, born 20th March 1912 and trying to find out where he was during the war. Born in London. Married 1936. Son born 1939. On the 1939 register with his wife in London, working as a head porter/letting agent for flats. His daughter is born in July 1940. When her birth is registered in October 1940 his occupation is given as a private in the Gloucestershire Regiment - which his brother in law had joined in 1934. However, although we were able to get the brother-in-law's war record several years ago, the Glosters have no record of our man ever being in the regiment. So I have a couple of questions -

    Given his age and marital status and pre-war occupation, would he have been called up around the second half of 1940? Does that time line fit the details on his daughter's birth certificate?

    Secondly, if he was deemed medically unfit, what would a 27/28 year old of his background have done during the war? By 1945 he was living back in London, but don't know anything about the years in between.

    Only thinking that he may have been medically unfit because years later his son didn't have to do National Service because of very bad eyesight, but it's only a supposition.

    Sorry for the generalness of all these questions, but my background knowledge is the AIF and New Guinea which doesn't help at all here.

    Any and all help of where to look or what to look for would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks so much.
     
  2. Temujin

    Temujin Member

    Can you give us a Name? And any other details?
     
  3. His name was George Gothard. Wife Doris Irene, who went by Irene. They lived in Brent Street, Hendon, London in 1939. Later moved to Courthope road in London. Sorry, I'm not sure what information would be really useful.
     
  4. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    is this him
    1912
    Gothard George (mothers maiden name=Critchell) Greenwich 1d 1828 [​IMG] [​IMG]

    FreeBMD - Search

    He was the same age as my father and my father joined up Sept 1940

    link to service record below if you decide you have enough info to apply
    £30 plus date of birth and death cert required
    Get a copy of military service records

    Other forum members will be along shortly to advise further
    whatever you do do not join paid for sites promising info on him they wont have it

    regards
    Clive
     
    4jonboy likes this.
  5. Uncle Target

    Uncle Target Well-Known Member

    Last edited: Jun 15, 2021
  6. yes, that's him.

    I don't have a death cert for him because I don't know where he went after their divorce in 1961 or I would apply. He would be 109 now though.

    Thank you so much for replying.
     
  7. thanks. He was a porter/letting agent before the war, but only 27 so you would think fairly fit.

    Thanks for replying.
     
  8. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    Interesting comment in the last column of the 1939 register that would be good to crack:
    Gothard.jpg
    I can't work out what it means at present, perhaps others can. YASA doesn't appear to be a 1939 'letter code' and 1955314 is a Royal Engineers service number, but that may be a complete red herring, the date seems to be 27.5.44.
     
    CL1 likes this.
  9. Wow - I've looked at that a few times, but didn't really know anything about it.

    That's exciting.
     
  10. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    ? Admitted to Southwark Union workhouse:
    Name: George Gothard
    Admission Age: 18
    Record Type: Admission
    Birth Date: abt 1912
    Admission Date: 8 Jan 1930
    Admission Place: Southwark, Southwark, London, England
     
    CL1 likes this.
  11. If it helps - ASA is the code on the 1939 for St Pancras, London. On the 1945 electoral roll George is living in Warren Street, St Pancras, so that would fit maybe with them moving from Hendon to St Pancras in 1944? I'm not sure about the "Y" - was it the letter used on governmental records to denote that a soldier had been wounded or was ill?
     
  12. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    When researching family history you have to be prepared for anything, Illustrated Police News 23 April 1936.
    Gothard 2.jpg
     
    CL1 and Tricky Dicky like this.
  13. yes, I knew about his police record and that wasn't his first tussle with the law, though it was his first time in prison. The only time that I'm aware of, but you never know. I think he thought he was like an Agatha Christie character from the Golden Age of Crime. Bit sad though - his wife lost their first child at that time. Must have been very stressful for her.
     
  14. yes, that's him. He had 2 or 3 stints in the workhouse during the depression. A couple of days each time as far as I can tell.
     
  15. Uncle Target

    Uncle Target Well-Known Member

    On line Acronym finder sayLook up Social Services in Britain Google Books pdf (possible?)
    Seems to be in the ME and India though.

    Googled: Social Services in Britain 1944 but its a long read in Google Books
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2021
  16. thanks :)
     
  17. I have a couple of questions now that everyone has been so helpful thus far:

    If George was called up and initially was destined for the Glosters, could he have ended up in the Royal Engineers instead? and

    Who would I contact if this is a Royal Engineers number? I have applied for military records once before in 2013, but that was a Glosters record and I had a death certificate.

    Thanks again
     
  18. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    These are the listed deaths
    FreeBMD - Search


    Deaths Mar 1960 (>99%)
    GOTHARD George W 70 Thurrock 4a 935 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Deaths Mar 1962 (>99%)
    GOTHARD George J 77 Manchester 10e 676 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Deaths Mar 1963 (>99%)
    GOTHARD GEORGE H 71 YORK 2D 1018 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Deaths Sep 1965 (>99%)
    GOTHARD GEORGE H 63 REDBRIDGE 5D 543 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Deaths Sep 1966 (>99%)
    GOTHARD GEORGE F 64 MANCHESTER 10E 45 [​IMG] [​IMG]


    Surname First name(s) DoB District Vol Page
    Deaths Sep 1969 (>99%)

    GOTHARD George Albert 6Oc1886 Rotherham 2c 1293 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Deaths Mar 1972 (>99%)
    GOTHARD George 5Mr1902 Burton 9b 55 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    GOTHARD George 30My1898 Sheffield 2d 609 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Deaths Mar 1973 (>99%)
    GOTHARD GEORGE BURT 26NO1898 NTHMBLND S 1B 1268 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Deaths Dec 1976 (>99%)
    GOTHARD GEORGE HENRY W 5AP1909 DERBY 6 795 [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Deaths 1986 (89%)
    GOTHARD GEORGE 2JE1914 ANDOVER 20 39 [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  19. thank you :)
     
  20. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    I don't want to get you on the wrong track, I would be careful about taking it as an RE service number, perhaps just coincidental. In WW2 soldiers carried their original service number with them so if George did sign up with the Glosters he would keep that number. Just as a check perhaps someone on the forum could come up with an enlistment date for 1955314.

    I think the first query is to find out what YASA refers to.

    Edit: Gloucestershire Regiment numbers were between 5172001 - 5239000
     
    CL1 likes this.

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