No 4 Enfield with red bands

Discussion in 'Weapons, Technology & Equipment' started by Dave55, Jan 29, 2022.

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  1. Dave55

    Dave55 Atlanta, USA

    Saw this at a gun show today.

    At first I thought they were the red bands used to mark rifles in British service that did not fire .303 ammo but then saw it was a No. 4 in .303. I asked the vendor what they meant and he said he had no idea. I think I believe him but you never know. I looked around the net and there are several references to red banded No 4s and they all say it means a British armorer determined that they were beyond repair or unsafe to fire. Anyone know if this is true?

    Be a shame for someone to buy it for $699 and not be able to shoot it.

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    Notice it is next to a 100% fake 'Jungle Carbine' made from a cut down Ishapore SMLE 2A1 in 7.62.NATO

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  2. idler

    idler GeneralList

    Maybe just the once...

    It seems unlikely that a condemned 'live' rifle would be permitted to stay in the system, even for training. They may have been destined to be converted to DPs (Drill Purpose - blocked/cutaway barrel, no firing pin and hole in bolt face filled, white bands with black DP markings) but perhaps that never happened to this one.
     
  3. AB64

    AB64 Senior Member

    Strange, red bands were used as a sign of non standard ammunition on weapons issued to the Home Guard that used .30-06 ammo P17's for example so odd they would put it on a .303 as that just invites confusion
     
  4. Blutto

    Blutto Plane Mad

    Searching around the 'net the red paint issue pops up frequently, even a thread on this site from 2010 raised the question. So far nothing I've read really answers the paint on your example. It has been reported to indicate a non-standard calibre on rifles supplied to the Home Guard, condemned rifles used as drill rifles in Indian use and the same in commonwealth cadet forces. Something of an enduring mystery.
     
  5. ceolredmonger

    ceolredmonger Member

    You are all correct!
    The red band was used to differentiate between the P17 and P14/Rifle No.2 to avoid ammunition problems.
    However, it had long been the means an armourer would mark a weapon as not practically repairable to a standard for firing. These were still used for drill and training however should not go near a range or live ammunition. Eventually they would be exchanged for either a good replacement or an issue DP modified version.
     
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  6. Dave55

    Dave55 Atlanta, USA

  7. Listy

    Listy Well-Known Member

    That was my understanding. It's why you see rifles with EY cup dischargers fitted with red banding. The EY is purported to come from 'EmergencY use' only. And is there to denote that yes you can fire it, but it's so worn the accuracy will be terrible.
     
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