Newspapers and El Alamein

Seeing as how I have a bunch of questions tonight, i'll pose another slightly easier one. I'm specifically interested in how el Alamein and the Torch landings appeared in the post, and how quickly news was allowed to be published or got back.

So when did british newspapers first start reporting victories of Torch and El Alamein? Does anyone have any access to newspaper archives they could look up for me? And find out when/how they were reported.

The reason is; I have an interview with a veteran I've just finished as a number of accounts that say the guards had no idea where they were heading when they left glasgow for north africa... but the headline of page 3 of the glasgow herald that day read "allies plan to invade tunis" which is what they call a bit of a give away. As a result i'm really interested in seing how fast information dissemination worked in the 1940's.

 

The Times first reported the 2nd Battle of El Alamein on October 26th. This was 12 hours or so after the Australian press, also on October 26th. In fact, even the Swiss papers had it that morning!

Operation Torch was in The Times on November 9th.

If you have a UK library card, most libraries now offer free access to The Times Online Archive - check your library's website. Australian papers can be accessed via their National Library:

NLA Australian Newspapers

Also useful is Google News Archive - mainly US papers, but some British, Canadian and Australian.

Google News Archive Search - Advanced Options

 

Good news always travels fast.

Regards
Tom

 

The Times first reported the 2nd Battle of El Alamein on October 26th. This was 12 hours or so after the Australian press, also on October 26th. In fact, even the Swiss papers had it that morning!

Operation Torch was in The Times on November 9th.

If you have a UK library card, most libraries now offer free access to The Times Online Archive - check your library's website. Australian papers can be accessed via their National Library:

NLA Australian Newspapers

Also useful is Google News Archive - mainly US papers, but some British, Canadian and Australian.

Google News Archive Search - Advanced Options


Thanks for that; the really helpful bit was the library bit as I didn't realize they had a library database... I thought it was just a pay per view thing on their site. As a result I can now abuse my doctorate privelages and use my unviersity access to get these. Its interesting however to note that they don't have the issue for the 8th november, the day of Torch and the article on page 2 of the times on the 9th nov '42 reads like its a follow up story; I'm guessing it was announced on the radio and everyone already knew.

 

Good news always travels fast.

Regards
Tom

I like the hitchikers quote:
"Motivated by the fact that the only thing in the Universe that travels faster then light is bad news, the Hingefreel people native to Arkintoofle Minor constructed a starship powered by bad news. Unfortunately, the ship's drives didn't work terribly well, and, even if they did, their fuel source rendered them incredibly unwelcome, thus defeating the whole point."

 

Phaethon
A note: The 8th was a Sunday and the online Times Archives doesn't include images of any Page 1/Front page either.

During the 1940s, the Times' front page was entirely made up of classified ads.

Best, Alan

 

Phaethon
A note: The 8th was a Sunday and the online Times Archives doesn't include images of any Page 1/Front page either.


Hmm, was no sunday times in existance then? Does anyone have any other good newspapers archives I can see if I can scav from my university for free?

Incidentally I know about the ads on the front page inthe 40's, its amazing how dull newspapers looked then. No sense of marketing.

 

Phaethon
A note: The 8th was a Sunday and the online Times Archives doesn't include images of any Page 1/Front page either.
Heh. Correct on the first count, but not the second The Times didn't put news on its front page until May 3rd 1966.

 

Hmm, was no sunday times in existance then? Does anyone have any other good newspapers archives I can see if I can scav from my university for free?

Incidentally I know about the ads on the front page inthe 40's, its amazing how dull newspapers looked then. No sense of marketing.
Most comprehensive listing of online papers I've come across is this Dutch one:

kranten-historisch.startpagina.nl

Many of them free. Some pay archives, but if you have academic access you might be able to get past their paywalls. If your French is good I can recommend the Swiss Le Temps archive and Gallica. German is harder to find, but the Austrian ANNO collection is superb: unfortunately it's not text searchable and at present only goes up to 1939, but 1940 will come on line in January 2011 - 70-year copyright rule. Diario de Lisboa is interesting too.

There's also Papers Past in New Zealand. At present nothing later than 1932, but they're starting to digitise later issues as from July, including some up to 1945.

 

Thanks for correcting me guys, makes me feel a lot better now about not being able to read the front page.

There's no second or third page on my arhcives either. I'm guessing the times didn't have a sunday version then?

 

There's no second or third page on my arhcives either. I'm guessing the times didn't have a sunday version then?

The first couple of inside pages of the Times tended to have display advertisements, shipping and legal notices, sports results, etc.

As far as I know the Times has never published on a Sunday. The Sunday Times - confusingly - is a completely different paper, with its own editorial staff, even though - even more confusingly - they're currently owned by the same publisher.

On Sunday, 8th November, 1942, the Observer led with: "8th Army on Heels of Fleeing Enemy" and "New Russian Gain in Stalingrad." No word of TORCH.

Best, Alan

 

The first couple of inside pages of the Times tended to have display advertisements, shipping and legal notices, sports results, etc.

As far as I know the Times has never published on a Sunday. The Sunday Times - confusingly - is a completely different paper, with its own editorial staff, even though - even more confusingly - they're currently owned by the same publisher.

On Sunday, 8th November, 1942, the Observer led with: "8th Army on Heels of Fleeing Enemy" and "New Russian Gain in Stalingrad." No word of TORCH.

Best, Alan

There you go, I never knew that. (mind you you are talking to someone who for ten years in the states could only get the international mail so honestly thought immigrants were running around britain with no clothes on, and eating all the swans).

All the news in the times in the 1940's seems to start on page 4. Being a psychologist i think its really amazing how little attention people paid to attention grabbing covers.

 

For Monday 9 Nov 1942

Thanks so much!!! but that's the 9th. I was talking about the 8th.. but I see from the post above that confusingly the sunday times isn't really the times, either, even though they are owned by the same people . Sign of the times I guess.

How times change (or don't).

 

Thanks so much!!! but that's the 9th. I was talking about the 8th.. but I see from the post above that confusingly the sunday times isn't really the times, either, even though they are owned by the same people . Sign of the times I guess.

How times change (or don't).

No worries, you're certainly not the first person to be confused by this.

In Selling Hitler, his book about the notorious diaries fraud, Robert Harris describes the reign of terror that existed in both papers after News Corp's buyout, especially the abuse heaped on the Sunday Times' editor Frank Giles: "his relationship with Murdoch was akin to that between a rabbit and a stoat." Murdoch's office on the sixth floor of the Times building looked right across to Giles' office at the Sunday Times. Apparently Murdoch "would stand up with a big grin and his fingers pointed like a pistol, fire 'bang bang!' at Giles working with his back to the window." He once left a meeting with the Times' editor Harold Evans, saying: "Just going over to terrorize Frank."

 

On my database, which I think is the only one, there was an option to search in between dates or on specific days (on the advanced search function); but it was being a bit arsey for me as the first few times I didn't need to enter a term, but then it started asking for it as a required field. I ended up putting "the" in just like you!

 

While all you knowledgeable chaps are together ... how do you get to view all pages for a given day in the Times ... is there a simple way I have missed/overlooked?

All the pages come up automatically if you use the browse function in the Times Digital Archive 1785-1985, but I think you may be using a different database. To get the TDA you usually have to be affiliated with a subscribing university.

Best, Alan