Modelling - the 24th Lancers...

Discussion in 'Modelling' started by Ramiles, Jan 10, 2017.

  1. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    By the way, any practitioners of 24th Lancer kit? My guess is there ought to be one or too, judging by...

    Tamiya British Sherman VC Firefly with 6 Figures 1:35 - Scale Modelling Now

    One of the options...

    Decals
    The decals are well printed giving the modeller a choice of four vehicles:

    1. A Sqd 24th Lancers 8th Armoured Brigade Normandy June 1944

    I think similar here too... Battlegroups

    [​IMG]
    With: "I also painted my 24th Lancer Armoured Platoon of three Sherman III’s and a Firefly VC. These were painted Vallejo Firefly Green (FWP348) and dry-brushed with a little Crusader Sand (FWP363) added to the Russian Uniform." from the author there.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2019
  2. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    IMG_2147.JPG Tasca produced this one a few years ago. Not sure how they validated their artwork or whether the Tasca and Tamiya versions are related in any way.
     
  3. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    I always think that there might be some "bumf" in the kits to explain "who" the 24th Lancers are/were. Though perhaps not?

    I think you were consulted Steve for some of the kits at some point? Or was that for an(other)?

    Rm.
     
  4. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Rob

    I was consulted for a different kit: the Bronco 1/35 model of the British A34 Comet which they marked up as my fathers tank when he was with 3RTR (T335335 'Celerity').
     
  5. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    TORO MODEL 35D14 - 1:35 Polish Sherman tanks 1st Armoured Division NWE 44-45 vol.2
    etc.

    That Tasca kit gets marvellous reviews.
    Reading that the Tamiya kit with figures is the very same Tasca model, with all the etch etc.. Can only be a good thing as Tamiya 35th Shermans were getting a bit long in the tooth.


    Hmmm. Been thinking about doing a model again after several years off.
    Not sure though. Annoyingly I'd possibly want to go obscure German... or a nice 38t. Wonder if there're any recent 38t kits.
    Oh... one or two.
    Panzer 38(t) reviews in 1:35
     
  6. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    Bronco Comet...
    Now. Hmmm, again. That was coming out about when I stopped.

    Oh dear. I see my glue has evaporated. (not a euphemism)
     
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  7. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    At one point, whilst in the army in the UK, gd wrote:

    "The move is somewhat vague at the moment but I gather that we shall sleep there on Tues.

    Being Orderly this week has put a load on my shoulders. To make matter’s worse I have had a couple brought in from Newmarket for being drunk and disorderly and that want day guards. But it’s better that taking on for the first week in a new place.
    (Can't quite make sense of the "But it’s better that taking on for the first week in a new place" - so I'll have to recheck the original to see that I have transcribed it correctly - Rm.) *

    I am getting along with the lighter but I think it’s too small, so have struck a bargain, I’m going to make a plane for a chap and he’s going to get me a lighter. They’re particularly good, but I’ll continue with the little one to see how it goes."

    I'm umming and ah-ing on whether this was whilst with the 9th or 24th L - though the "Newmarket and Orderly" bit might give this away... as he only rose to corporal or lance corporal I think during (and at the very end) of his time with the 9th L.

    Couldn't see any mention of "Newmarket" tho. in "None Had Lances" - NHL - the regimental history of the 24thL. Re...

    Batman (military) - Wikipedia

    Family lore has him being a "Batman" too. Not the caped crusader though :smug:

    Think he used to make lots of models, might still be a few about, and it was useful I guess if he could exchange them for nice things.

    * he might have meant it was better being Orderly then, rather than taking up the duty "on for the first week in a new place" - as to me that makes more sense.

    So maybe... "But it’s better that (than) taking on (the role of Orderly) for the first week in a new place."
     
  8. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    I saw the reviews too, as one not too familiar with the "ground troops" - i.e. "six Tamiya British infantry figures" around the tanks I'm assuming these are generic infantry sets i.e. not meant to represent figures from the 24th L? So in addition to the 24th L tank crews, the 24th L had lots of others "there" and I've always been intrigued with these i.e. the motocyclists of the 24th L and the trucks and water carriers etc. As the idea one sometimes gets is, superficially, they (24th L) were "there" only in tanks :unsure:

    Would the tank regiments have had their own little bits of "infantry" in support - i.e. 24th L with stens on the ground etc? I'd assume so - i.e. one or two "guard" troops or boots-on-the-ground but I thought it was a question that's had me (still) stumped.

    i.e. as in Tank battalion
    Not "just" the tanks

    So basically - are the infantry in the kit - 24th L "ground troops" potentially - or would they only ever be infantry from other regiments the 24th L were working with?

    All the best,

    Rm.
     
  9. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    It's just a thing that Tamiya have always done.
    Chucking in another figure set to a given model.
    Infantry On Patrol, Tamiya 35223 (1999)
    1999 release date so ought to be alright, though I always liked the Dragon 35th scale figures with their multiple parts and slide-moulding.

    Mixed up infantry & tanks, why not? Big old war and plenty of shots of Infantry around veehickles.
    But then I was of the modelling school of 'yeah, looks fine and I enjoyed making it'. Never really went too far down the rabbithole of total accuracy, so if they were nicely cast decent-looking and roughly the right period that'd do me.
    In the words of Monty Python: "It's only a model."

    [​IMG]
    THE BRITISH ARMY IN THE NORMANDY CAMPAIGN 1944. © IWM (B 7513)
    IWM Non Commercial Licence




    Oh crap.
    Now I've seen this... Hmmm. Who makes a decent Tilly 1...
    91yPZuLGwJL._SL1500_.jpg
     
  10. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Rob

    24L spent a lot of time at Chippenham Park...which is a few miles north of Newmarket. A popular posting as a number of the officers and men were horsey types....one guy (I think it was Mike Aird the first CO) who, according to None Had Lances, even wore spurs at one stage.

    24L didn't have their own infantry attached. They did, however, always go into battle with attached infantry...or was it the other way round? Anyway, after D-Day they captured St Pierre with Durham Light Infantry and supported infantry regiments in both 50th and 49th Divisions after that. The most notorious combination was at Rauray when they supported 49th Divisions Tyneside Scottish Regiment.
     
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  11. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    My thoughts were (drifting) off modelling somewhat, on the connections made with people etc, as I think basically I've only really heard from those relatives of people that served in the tanks. Albeit, Leonard Willis (clerk???) - the author of NHL excepted. And the Padre and the MO. Yet when you look at the roll there were many, many of them about, "somewhere" i.e. not in the tanks.

    Whilst with the SRY he (gd) mentions one bit for example - not with the tanks - when he is going after prisoners, hunting them out and rounding them up, also wth a Sten gun. Albeit he might perhaps have been "attached". Plus, i.e. when he "lost" a tank and was "out in the trucks".

    Plus the odd stories etc. of "doing a bit of scouting ahead" on foot, before sending in the tanks...

    Seeing too a few accounts of tank crews and ancillaries in jeeps, re. vulnerability and losses.

    Rm.
     
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  12. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Apologies to Rob for highjacking the thread.

    Adam

    Unevaporate the glue!

    It's got to be a Bronco Comet marked up as dad's tank. They've changed the boxart recently but Celeritys decals are still included.

    IMG_2149.JPG

    A Dutch company has even restored a 1/1 scale version so you would be in good company...
     
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  13. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    I did "find" this one... which the website marks down as "of the SRY"...
    Dave's Tank Workshop : Sherman 1 Hybrid - Sherwood Rangers Yeomanry Summer 1944
    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    Modeled in the style of the IWM picture... [​IMG]

    But there's a "snag" ...

    [​IMG]

    As as he says "Markings were from the new Archer range of British formation signs, and rub-down census numbers. "

    And those are not the Notts Yeo colours.... for June/July Normandy 1944 - albeit I'm hazy on whether things got really jigged around after the 24th L were disbanded and things got reorganised in the 8th Armoured etc. after August 1944...

    Alot of the pictures after that don't show markings I can pick out anyhow :unsure:

    Rm.
     
  14. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
  15. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    I thought the centre spread (pages 42-43) was particularly appropriate.

    Excellent day all round. We had a job actually keeping Reg out of the turret in case we couldn't get him back out again! He's a very sprightly 95 years young.
     
  16. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Found another, example here of some miniature 24th L's : [TMP] "24th Lancers Normandy Shermans." Topic

    This time in a 24th Lancer A squadron troop set (as seen by the yellow triangle) with a humber scout included :)

    [​IMG]

    Albeit - 2x75mm gun Shermans and a Firefly in between, so not really the 24th L way, with their 75mm gun Shermans and Firefly only troops. :omg::blush::whistle:

    I had another look via. google: 24th lancer Firefly troop - Google Search

    With plenty of links - on the topic - and it seems funny still to me, how contradictory they are still there in reference though ;)

    Allied WWII AFV Discussion Group: Normandy Firefly stowage pattern, 24th Lancers

    Hard Fighting

    The D-Day Landing on Gold Beach

    Was wondering if the 24th L went to the effort of camouflaging their 17 pdrs. i.e.

    For example as in:
    [​IMG]

    Or other forms, i.e. as also in: Sherman Firefly

    Since it might not have made as much sense (or been as necessary) if your Fireflies were all in one troop.

    And then came across some pics in here: Sherman Firefly

    ...of some other regiments that also appeared to use dedicated troops of Firefly tanks, rather than opting (or only being able) to have only one Firefly per troop. ... i.e. "15th August - A troop of Fireflies from B squadron of one of the regiments of Polish 2nd Warszawska Armoured Division spruced up for a parade at the end of the war in Italy."

    This is interesting to me - as I thought I had read somewhere that Firefly only troops were quite quickly phased out, perhaps after the initial experience of their use, or perhaps rather, problems with troops that were only comprised of 75mm gun Shermans and had no Firefly (to back them up - so to speak), but there is a nice picture in there of one of Polish 2nd Warszawska Armoured Division's Firefly troops that seems to have been in a parade (as late as) at the end of the war in Italy.

    Ps. The text in Sherman Firefly refs. to Monty are worth noting too, i.e. that he "believed that ultimately Fireflies would replace 75mm gun tanks in all British regiments" but in practice "the greater versatility of the 75mm gun continued to be appreciated".
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2017
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  17. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

  18. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Some more on the subject of tank models, firefly barrel camouflage and a tank platoon:

    Published on 11 Nov 2016: What is the basic unit for tanks? How big is it? How does it operate? How are orders conveyed? All this and a bit more.

     
  19. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Another "example" - this from "April 9th 2019 - Product Spotlight"
    http://blog.themotorpool.net/product-spotlight-the-fireflies-of-summer/

    [​IMG]

    With, for example: "As we continue to wait for the Forces of Valor 88mm FLak gun to arrive, there appears to be some progress in the 1:32 scale queue. Earlier today, the manufacturer provided details concerning their second release – a British M4A4 Sherman Firefly Mk. VC medium tank. Based on a vehicle that served with the 24th Lancers, 13th/18th Hussars, 8th Armoured Brigade, the repurposed vehicle now comes with a Chrysler A57 Multi-Bank Engine that fits inside a reworked hull, retooled tracks to make them easier to roll, and a better paint job, making it a fitting addition to the Forces of Valor pantheon of combat vehicles."

    &

    Waltersons, the new caretakers of the Forces of Valor brand, claims that the vehicle run should be completed by the end of April, meaning it will still take several weeks before it arrives here in North America. We have therefore tentatively fixed its arrival for June, appropriate for it marks the 75th Anniversary of the D-Day landings.”

    http://www.themotorpool.net/British-M4A4-Sherman-Firefly-Medium-Tank-Normandy-p/fov801036a.htm
     
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