Locations of 105 HAA Normandy & NW Europe

I am currently in the process of planning a trip in 2017 with my father in law to follow in the footsteps of his father who served with 105 Heavy Anti-Aircraft throughout the NW Europe campaign.

I have his service records (L/Bdr John Thompson) and a copy of the battalion diaries from 1st January 1944 to November 1946 which contain a series of grid references indicating the locations of the various batteries.

It would be great to be able to visit at least some of these locations although I appreciate that many may not be possible any more. I read somewhere that grid references in war diaries may have been deliberately inaccurate by a set amount for security purposes - can anyone confirm this?

I would be grateful if anyone could advise me the best way to identify these locations on the ground. I wondered if the reproduction wartime issue maps would be useful or accurate enough or whether something more "modern" might fit the bill.

I would be grateful for any advice.

 

hello
have a look at this it might help

The "Coordinates Translator"
Finding war time grid references


regards
Clive

 

Many thanks Clive, I need a little time to get my head around it but that does look useful!

 

The only proper way is to consult period maps. The co-ordinates translators, while quite good, can still, on occasions, be many metres out....but that won't be obvious so you could easily end up in the wrong location.

Map references were always accurate. Any other suggestion is an Urban Myth.

Copies of maps are often available on eBay and scanned copies can come up very cheap. You can also download period maps from several web sites...try McMaster Library for starters....they have a full set at 1:100000 and 1:250000 scales. Maps at 1:25000 scale are also available from various sites but, by definition, there are hundreds of them!

If you need help re specific map references, please just ask and I'll do my best to help.

Also remember that, when reading war diaries, it often mentions map sheet numbers. This is very important because a map reference number does repeat every so often and you could end up in the wrong area!

 

I'm glad that the bogus GR story turns out to be hokum, its difficult enough to find the right spot without some kind of subterfuge going on! Many thanks for the advice and for the offer of help - I think that I might need it!

Many of the locations Lance Bombardier Thompson found himself in will be under concrete now particularly around about Antwerp where they were stationed in various locations trying to bring down V1's or "divers" as they knew them. Hopefully, there will still be a few spots that we can visit....

I'll get on and try to find the maps as you suggest. The unit war diaries do indicate which map, scale and sheet are referred to in most cases which helps considerably.

Thanks again, this will help the planning of the trip considerably

 

Hopefully this link to a 1944 map of the Belgium-Antwerp area overlaid onto a modern satellite image will help. You will need to zoom in and out to get a full appreciation of how much development has occurred.

Note: this link lifted from stolpi's WW2 maps holland and Belgium thread.
WW2 maps: Holland & Belgium


Belgium - 1:50,000 - GSGS 4040 - 1943-44 - National Library of Scotland

 

Bluebell Minor and myself are researching command and units in Germany post 8 May 45 have the following
Jun 45 – 105th Heavy Anti-Aircraft Regiment RA of 101st Anti-Aircraft Brigade RA command 8 Corps District
Weisenheim Orphanage and Staumannweg Alster Hamburg
Oct 45 – disbanded
We would be very interested in RHQ and battery location GRs from 8 May 45
Best of luck with your research

 

Many thanks for the further references. The 1:50000 of Belgium with the aerial overlay is particularly useful. I've been able to located some of the GRs from the War Diary and have been successful with a couple of locations which seem to be in open country. As I had suspected, others are now built up - one in particular was a disappointment as it used to be an orchard where a specific incident occurred with a premature that L/Bdr Thompson related in latter years - its now seems to be under an industrial estate - Shame....

Historic Steve, when I get half an hour, I should be able to cross reference some of the locations that you require but I have a feeling that much of their equipment had been parked up by then and they were on battlefield clearance and POW duties. I'll check and post later.

Many thanks once again for the assistance.

 

The grid references in the War Diaries should not have been falsified for security purposes. They are not always accurate, written up during the war and based on the information available to the unit. This is more of a problem when trying to reconstruct a confused combat rather than for an HAA Regiment which operated from gun positions surveyed to ten digits.

You may need to take care with the grid references in upper Normandy. The grid system changes from the system used in Normandy to the projection used in North East France. I don't know where 105 Regt HAA's deployed, but Routledge has them landing at Utah beach on 19-20th Auguat and part of the AA defences for Cherbourg on 31st August as part of 101 AA Brigade.