Discussion in 'The War at Sea' started by Norm D., Jun 27, 2015.

  1. ddaycolin

    ddaycolin Member

    I am Colin Henderson and I was in touch with Jack Bartle and several other members of the crew of LCI(s) 535.
    Do you know if Jack is still alive?
    I'd love to know
    Colin (ddaycolin)
  2. ddaycolin

    ddaycolin Member

    Hi Michel
    I'm back on the site at last!
    Hope to be in contact.
    LCI(S) 535 was serial 291

    Closest to Warsash pier on 5 June was (as filmed by Sgt N Clague and photographed by Capt Leslie Evans)

    501 (293) then
    538 (292)
    535 (291)
    509 (290)
    512 (289)
    This corresponds exactly to the original berthing plan for 5 June written by Lt Cdr Jack Deslandes (518-284)

    Still frame by Sgt Norman Clague _ crew of 535 (291) at stern. More photos available of 535
    Warsash 501_292 535_291.jpg
    Suzanne Vernon likes this.
  3. Hello Colin,

    Welcome back!

    Yes, as Guy Hudson noted in Post #20 above, it appears that Les Jordan simply switched the respective LTIN blocks for 3 Commando and for 45 (RM) Commando.

    Thanks for corroborating this with Lt Cdr Deslandes's berthing plan. Does it also mention other Hull/Serial number matches?

  4. ddaycolin

    ddaycolin Member

    Hi Michel

    Here is a photo of the berthing plan.
    Hull/Serial number matches are given in this plan. berthing plan Warsash.jpg
    SDP and Guy Hudson like this.
  5. Fantastic document Colin! Thank you for posting it.

    It really helps a lot in interpreting the various photos and film clips showing the Commandos embarking at Warsash.

    I only wish more docs like this one had survived!

  6. ddaycolin

    ddaycolin Member

    I think it was almost certainly Danny who sent me this plan a few years ago and it has been extremely helpful.
    I have good copies of all the photos and film of embarking at Warsash if you or people on WW2TALK are interested.
    I can extract still frames from almost any film at high definition (TIFFs of 10Mo or more). I received these films while I was working on the Channel 4 documentary. It's incredible the details you can find. Much more could be discovered with the expertise of people on the forum (vehicle serial numbers, equipment etc)

    While I was a regular visitor to the Commando Association in London I took these photos of Warsash with me and Commando veterans put many names to people in the photos. Just in photo H39041 at Warsash there must be about 20 names. For H39041 (just before leaving for Warsash) 21 members of A Troop 45 RM Commando have been identified.

    For the famous shot by Sgt George Laws of A Troop 4 Cdo in their LCA I was given 8 names by Joe Burnett (at the back of the LCA). I corresponded for a few years with George Laws and he gave me quite a bit of information too.

    I have compiled all this type of information in chapters for the book I have been working on for many years. It also includes many first hand accounts from Commandos and naval personnel I corresponded with. I was also in contact with about 5 AFPU cameramen and photographers who landed early on DDay. I've traced the routes followed by each cameraman or photographer and transposed this onto Google Maps. The best example is for George Laws film where I've managed to find the exact locations of each shot in Ouistreham

    I even investigated the destiny of a few unofficial photographers. More information on this topic could be found I think. One of the main preoccupations of the book was to situate where all the first hand accounts actually took place and when. Sometimes this meant meeting up with veteran commandos on Sword, discovering exactly where they landed and what routes they took inland. Some of this I filmed or photographed. Operational orders quite often help confirmed the routes planned vs those really used.

    So if you think an interesting thread could be developed on any of these themes just let me know!

  7. Colin,

    I somehow thought it might have been Danny, since he has repeatedly dug out similar gems from his documentary treasure in order to help us out :)

    I believe I can safely say that many of us would welcome discussing these subjects on this forum with such a "Commando expert" as you are. Hopefully we can contribute our small stone in areas you might be less familiar with. The adequate sub-forum might be the Commando one here (link):
    but that will of course depend on the particular subject treated.

    Looking forward to your first thread,

  8. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic


    Can I ask where you found that Berthing Plan? It might provide clues as to where others may be found: I realise this is needle in haystack stuff but the smaller the haystack the easier it might be to find the needle!

    Note: my interest is Gold Beach where at least the LSTs were US crewed - always nice for the powers that be to throw in another 'wobbly'.
  9. DannyM

    DannyM Member

    The Berthing Plan was kept as a souvenir by someone in the Squadron. Although every Flotilla/Squadron likely had something similar I have yet to find any.

    Some LCT were issued an individual sheet with sailing details etc on it as well.


    Last edited: Aug 11, 2017
  10. Norm.
    I am new to this site. My uncle was no 3 commando. Queen Red. Are the numbers before army commando the group or troop! As I'm trying to find out what LCI he was on ?
  11. Hello Mr Henderson
    I am desperately trying to find crew disposition lists for LCI (s) no 3 commando. I can see from the records on here that No 3 were in LCI 30944/289-293. My uncle fell on sword beach or before the LCI reached land? Queen Red.
    Can you possibly help?
  12. Also how do we discover what Troop he was in? Will the LCI give this info?
    Casualty lists ?
  13. ddaycolin

    ddaycolin Member

    Hello Suzanne
    Could you first give me your uncle's full name (and rank if possible). I'd be pleased to help if I can. I also met and have several accounts from Commandos who were with 3 Commando and officers and men of LCI(s) s 289, 290, 291, 292, 293. I also have photos and film of these craft embarking and landing on SWORD.
    All the best
    Colin Henderson
    Small 512 likes this.
  14. Hi Colin, wow thank you Charles T Vernon (Private. ) I'd be very grateful if you could see if there is any reference to him? Is there surviving no 3 veterans?

    UOTE="ddaycolin, post: 760406, member: 47473"]Hello Suzanne
    Could you first give me your uncle's full name (and rank if possible). I'd be pleased to help if I can. I also met and have several accounts from Commandos who were with 3 Commando and officers and men of LCI(s) s 289, 290, 291, 292, 293. I also have photos and film of these craft embarking and landing on SWORD.
    All the best
    Colin Henderson[/QUOTE]
  15. ddaycolin

    ddaycolin Member

    Hi Suzanne,

    Your uncle could have been on LCI(s) 509 ( LTIN 290) which suffered many casualties (around 30 killed from 6 Troop) when she hit a mine just off the beach.

    Have a look at the site:

    which has nominal rolls of the members of most Commando Troops and a Roll of Honour for those killed in action. I will have a look tomorrow too.
    I was in touch with the late Ronald Martin who was cox'n on 509 and he wrote an account. I have compiled all the accounts I have on 3 Commando landing which I could let you have. The landing was filmed by Sgt Ian Grant and a cluster of 3 LCI(s) can be distinguished : 509, 512 (3 Commando) and 517 (45 RM Cdo).

    More later
  16. Hi do you have any info of 501?
  17. Wow can I possibly see all the accounts for no 3 landing?
    Very much appreciated thank you so much
  18. ddaycolin

    ddaycolin Member

  19. Hi Colin. Do you have any of the accounts and footage you mentioned for 3 troop?

    Thank you so much for your help.
  20. For those of you who, like me, had a difficult time deciphering the fabulous Loading Plan found by Danny and posted by Colin in post #24 above, I've transcribed it in Excel form (attached) for better readability. I hope I didn't make too many mistakes o_O.


    [Edited 15 Aug 22, replacing attachment with corrected version. Thanks to James Angert for pointing out the typo]

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Aug 15, 2022 at 8:27 PM
    Tolbooth and Guy Hudson like this.

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