Ivor Godwin-Monck: Casualty 6/12/40

Discussion in 'War Grave Photographs' started by CL1, Sep 16, 2012.

  1. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    Dear All

    Another query I would be grateful for some assistance.I have mailed CWGC.

    Point of note.
    Islington Cemetery:A large 250 plus acres,you can see from one of the photos it has been rather overgrown.Since my last visit another 4 to 5 rows of graves have been uncovered which included a number of WW2 CWGC headstones plus near by 2 headstones replaced that I reported last year.

    The photo of the headstone attached show Godwin-Monk (Father) Godwin- Monck (Son)

    States Son died 6/12/40 Enemy action and also states he was in the RAF.

    Any help greatly appreciated.

    regards
    Clive
     

    Attached Files:

  2. KevinBattle

    KevinBattle Senior Member

    Well, he doesn't show up in CWGC database for that date, or as Godwin or Monck, but he did exist....
    Birth: Name: Ivor F C G Godwin-monck. Mother's Maiden Surname: Beaton. Date of Registration: 4th Qtr 1919. Registration district: Edmonton, Buckinghamshire. Volume: 3a. Page: 869

    Death: Name: Ivor F C G Monck. Birth Date: abt 1919. Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1940
    Age at Death: 21. Registration district: Chester, Cheshire. Volume: 8a. Page: 890.
    So, only just turned 21 as death recorded in same Qtr as Birth, and he died in the Chester area..... but can't seem to find much more
     
  3. DaveB

    DaveB Very Senior Member

    I had a similar situation here in Australia where I came across a WW2 era headstone that stated that the deceased was RAAF but I couldn't match it to any entry on the CWGC or the AWM ROH or even the WW2 Nominal Roll. There was no file in his name at the Australian National Archives.

    After a bit of searching I managed to track down a descendant of the family (he came from a relatively small town and the family still owned the same property) - the story as best she knew it was that the young bloke had been accepted for enlistment into the RAAF. However, he was killed in an accident near his home before he went to the city and actually signed up. Then, as now, there was a lag of a few weeks to a few months between acceptance for service and actually putting the uniform on.

    His family duly added "of RAAF" to his headstone to indicate that he had been accepted for the service of his country.


    No real way of knowing at this point, but it could be a similar occurence to the headstone you have located. The "of enemy action" could refer to his loss in a bombing raid or similar. But then, wouldn't he be considered to be Civilian War Dead??

    cheers



    Dave
     
  4. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    Hello Kevin and Dave

    Thank you for your help greatly appreciated.
    I have mailed CWGC to see if they have any further info.I will now pass on to Chris Harley to see if he can assist further.


    regards
    clive
     
  5. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    From CWGC

    Dear Clive
    Thank you for your enquiry.
    I am unable to find Ivor Francis Godwin-Monck on our records, I have tried various spellings of his name without success.
    I have also checked the National Archive records on line and so far I have drawn a blank.
    I am sorry but I cannot shed any light on this private memorial.
     
  6. chrisharley9

    chrisharley9 Senior Member

    All I can really suggest is that you obtain the DC to see what it says. We cannot access the service records at present

    Cheers

    Chris
     
  7. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    I have ordered DC

    thank you

    regards
    Clive
     
  8. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    I have receive DC and it states service number and death due to war operations.

    I have submitted this to CWGC


    regards
    Clive
     
  9. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    Dear Clive
    Thank you for the information.
    As per our telephone conversation I have passed this onto Records.
    If there are any gaps in the information no doubt they will be in touch but with the service number of death certificate I am hopeful they have what they require.
    Thank you
    Kind regards
    Cheryl
     
  10. BrianM59

    BrianM59 Senior Member

    According to 5th December 1940: Summary of Air Raids on Britain for the week 277 people appear to have died in air raids on London for the week ending 5th December - I'm sure someone might be able to look up details? But this source

    BBC - WW2 People's War - My father's diary, Nov 1840 - JAn 1942 Part 2

    claims no raids in London at all on day of 6th December and a short warning in the night?

    Whereas the relevant extract from the cabinet papers for the relevant dates here December 1940 - Events - UK War Cabinet mention an average of 80 enemy aircraft over this country for the 5/6/7th during the day, but no explicit mention of the night? They report two enemy machines lost and one of ours. Bristol was badly bombed by over 70 aircraft but no explicit mention of London until the night of the 8th December, Curiouser and curiouser?
     
  11. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    hello Brian

    thank you
    sorry should have said place of Death was Chester but buried London
    regards
    Clive
     
  12. ritsonvaljos

    ritsonvaljos Senior Member

    Clive:

    The wording on the headstone suggests to me this fellow may have been a Roman Catholic or, if not, possibly Anglo-Catholic. Do you happen to know the likely Catholic parish church that covers this area, by any chance?

    If this fellow was RC the relevant parish records may have his place of death and other details in their registers that could be helpful in your quest. He may also be on any parish war memorial they may have.

    Good luck.
     
  13. BrianM59

    BrianM59 Senior Member

    hello Brian

    thank you
    sorry should have said place of Death was Chester but buried London
    regards
    Clive

    No, my fault, it was there plain enough in the post, I just got all excited and didn't read it properly.
     
  14. BrianM59

    BrianM59 Senior Member

    I've become quite obsessed by this one - Chester has numerous places where RAF servicemen would legitimately be -RAF Sealand, RAF Hooton Park and the aircraft factory which is now BaE at Broughton. I can't find this young man on the register of missing aircrew anywhere, so I'm starting to think ground crew, killed in an air raid - headstone says 'by enemy action' so not a flying accident or something more mundane - I work near the old RAF Padgate and there are CWGC burials in the local church which were the result of traffic accidents and even 'flu. There were air raids on Chester at the end of November and on 5th December which damaged the cathedral, but I don't have any casualty lists for those. Might he have died of wounds - I realise some people escape the CWGC net, but under what circumstances. A unit would help, does his service number reveal anything - rank? Very interesting.
     
  15. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    Hello Brian

    states he was an AC2 accounts clerk



    regards
    Clive
     
  16. DaveB

    DaveB Very Senior Member

    Sorry to ask the bleeding obvious, but has anyone tried checking the white pages (or the UK phone book equivalent) for Godwin-Monk or Godwin-Monck or Godwin or Monk or Monck in the Islington area??

    It may be a tad naive as I have no real concept of how large Islington is, or where it is or even where Chester is in relation to it all - but you might stumble across a distant relative who can shed light on the story.

    Then again it is also possible that he was the end of the line and that no relatives exist.



    Also, what was the situation for local newspapers during the war? From what I can see here in Australia nearly every paper kept on being produced (with reduced number of pages and similar austerity measures) - would there be a local newspaper held in hardcopy by the local library service that might be worth looking into??




    Back when I made my original post in September I forgot to mention that I had checked the RAF Casualty lists published in Flight Global magazine for 1940/41 but I couldn't find any combination of his name.
     
  17. DaveB

    DaveB Very Senior Member

    I wonder if this is Godwin-Monck / Godwin-Monk Senior?

    HARINGEY

    [Three Seats]

    1964

    Mrs. A.F. Remington Lab 39,698 (52.1)
    L.A. Vitoria Lab 39,412
    Mrs. G.F. Dimson Lab 39,197
    A.G. Brown C 31,284 (40.5)
    H.H. Godwin-Monck C 30,849




    Greater London Council Election results: Haringey
     
  18. BrianM59

    BrianM59 Senior Member

    Dave - I don't actually work in Chester but was brought up in the Wirral and live in Liverpool now, so I will engineer some time in the local newspaper archive/library as soon as I can - love a bit of detective work. It most certainly is a singular name and not one you'd think could go unnoticed. Does that casualty list include all RAF personnel - I found an aircrew list? I keep coming back to that "By enemy action" so could he have been killed while on leave or out of uniform, off duty. There was definitely an air raid on Chester on the night of the 5th as it damaged the cathedral, but I got that from a history of the cathedral, not from any archives...I'll keep digging...
     
  19. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    Brian/Dave

    thank you for your help



    regards
    Clive
     
  20. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery Patron

    Information and DC sent to CWGC

    from CWGC today

    Dear Clive
    >
    > I have not received anything as yet.
    >
    > This would have gone from our Records Dept. to the Ministry of Defence who will confirm to us that we can commemorate Ivor Godwin-Monck.
    >
    > This can take some time.
    >
    > I will let you know when I receive anything.
    >
    > Kind regards
    >
    > Cheryl
     

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