Information on RWF acting major 30 corps HQ

Discussion in '53rd (Welsh) Division' started by Bond, Jan 1, 2013.

  1. Bond

    Bond Senior Member

    I recently picked up a named SD tunic to a Captain J R O Williams of the RWF who at some stage served with HQ 30 Corps and I was trying to find out if any more information was available about him and his history. I assume he was part of 53rd Welch div when they were attached to 30 Corps during the battle of the bulge and probably with 53rd prior to that. The tunic has a makers label for Chester and is dated July 1943, whilst written inside the skirt it has mention of him as an Acting Major with HQ 30 Corps.

    It reads;

    A. Maj Williams
    HQ 30 MIL.S.
    HQ 30 CORPS

    Thanks for any help in this matter.
  2. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    The Red Dragon lists the following Williams in the index:

    Captain A H Williams later Lt. Col.
    Lt. Col. E H W Williams
    Lt. Col. O Williams
    Maj. G J Williams
    Capt. K Williams
    and a Lt Williams no initial

    I suspect you may need to pull the XXX Corps GS/HQ War Diary at the National Archives to check the Officers Field Returns. I'm assuming Mil.S. stands for Military Security?

    Send Swiper a PM. He has a fair amount on this Regt and 53 Div.

    Good luck
  3. Bond

    Bond Senior Member

    Thank you very much Andy for the prompt reply and I expect you are correct that it will take a search of the 30 Corps war diary to find out any more.

    Here is the tailors label and the handwritten mention of 30 Corps, though it is difficult to take a good picture of it and I played with the colours etc to try and make it a bit clearer. The tunic has its black flash and RWF buttons, though I had to replace the collars which were visible as RWF from the shadow left from them.

    I had not thought of Military Security so that is something new to try and look at.

    I was hoping that Swiper would respond when he notices this thread, but if not I'll PM him as you suggest.

    Attached Files:

  4. Swiper

    Swiper Resident Sospan

    Just a starter...
    Royal WELCH Fusiliers
    53rd WELSH Division

    Massive bugbear of mine, ironically something started by Veterans of the Welch Regiment, continued by confused people on the continent and exaggerated further by several historians, and far too many websites.

    I don't immediately recall a JRO Williams but some of the RWF records are shocking...

    I'll flick through some of my material but the key answer would probably be in the Regimental Archives which are temporarily closed, pending appointment of a new Curator.

    There were a multitude of other RWF Bns that were in the UK, including a few which retained RWF traditions ( such as 71 ATR and 116 LAA) so he could, possibly, have also been involved with the RA (just to add a bit of confusion there...)

    Just polishing off a lot of work on 53 Div and the RWF at the moment, and if I don't have anything its fair to assume he was not involved in 53 Div from June-August 44, and very likely not involved from 42-44 with the Div. Before that becomes trickier!

    Also the tailors at Chester may help a bit. Will check my stuff if that offers a bit more of a clue.
  5. Bond

    Bond Senior Member

    Thanks for the reply and I apologise for the typo on the Welsh division. From the reference to 30 Corps written inside the lining, I assume he served after the dates you mention as the RWF as part of 53rd Division, were the only RWF units with 30 Corps that I am aware of and that was only from late 44 for a short period, and certainly after August 44.
    Tudor Williams likes this.
  6. Swiper

    Swiper Resident Sospan

    Well he could just be a Corps officer, and not necessarily have served in 53 Div.

    Also the Welsh/Welch thing just really bugs me as so many people get it wrong - even when they do know better. I hope it didn't take it too personally :)
  7. Bond

    Bond Senior Member

    Indeed, there is no evidence that he served with 53rd Div, just an assumption on my part as it seemed most likely, but he might have been a Corps officer as you suggest, all I know is his name, that he was RWF and at some stage served with 30 Corps.

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