Morning all, After many years of searching I found 2Lt McIntosh's service number in a local newspaper cutting for Ayr in December 1939! Questions are: does anybody have information on the 162nd OCTU for 1939? His number is 109033, does this come up in anyones records? He was gazetted straight from there into the 2nd RSF in France and was wounded on the 27th May 1940. He then disapears, no records, no photos.....NOTHING!! any thoughts on where to go next?
Is there a bit more info available as background to this? Do you have his full name? Where did you first hear of him?? In a publication or through family?
I have initials J.G. (nothing more I'm afraid) and some wonderful mentions in a diary from Lt. Livingstone-Bussell: May 11 From this day, our war started properly. The pundits of D Company were as follows:- Company Commander Captain J. N. E. Vaughan; 2nd in-command self; O.C. 16 Platoon 2/Lieut. McIntosh; O.C. 17 Platoon 2/Lieut. D. A. Livingstone; O.C. 18 Platoon, Platoon Sergeant Major Gilmour; Company Sergeant Major C.S.M. Rolfe; Company Quartermaster Sergeant C.Q.M.S. Wilson. At crack of dawn we left for Prouville, a march of 21 miles. Only a few people fell out with bad feet, principally the old lags. This was our first long march fully laden, and it was a hot day. Prouville was a small village with only one pub. We merely stopped the night here. Many evacuees were driving through the town, their cars piled high with baggage. May 16 Company position was onthe bank of the Charlroir Canal, and there was a large concrete bridge on our left flank. Spent all night digging in. I managed to get an hour's sleep in a farm house, which we used as Company Headquarters. The owners were still there and intended to stay, even if the Germans arrived, as they had done so in the last war. McIntosh distinguished himself by digging his trench on the very edge of a bank, so that the front of it was not bullet proof, and had to redo it all. May 20 The transport was delayed, so we put the Company into a barn to rest. Corporal Flynn and one or two others milked some cows which badly needed it. We went into the farmhouse where McIntosh cooked some scrambled egg very indifferently May 23 One of our positions was at a road junction which had been heavily shelled when we came in the day before, so we didn't feel too happy. When McIntosh’s platoon changed positions I told him to go ahead carrying his guns and ammunitions and I would send his tripods and other heavy stuff on later in his Platoon trucks and I told him where the truck would be. I thought this order would be clear enough for anyone, but when Johnny and I went round the Platoon positions at dusk to see whether the night lines had been set, we found that he hadn't even got his tripods and on being questioned, he replied, "I understood I was to leave them behind". This was definitely staggering as we thought we might be attacked at any minute. May 26 We eventually left Seclin at 3a.m. on foot and marched onto the main Lille road. McIntosh left a Bren gun and tripod behind and sent a message back for me to go and get it as I was bringing up the rear of the Company. I sent a message to him to send a man back on his platoon bicycle to get it. It was got. 27 May The Germans now started shelling us in dead earnest, while we were taking up our new positions. McIntosh was in the middle of a field when it started. He got hit in the legs and Sergeant Barnes was killed. he also appears in the offical war diaries list, but it's taken me 3 years of searching to find his number!! and that.... is all I have!
Not a mention in the journals or old comrades directories. He didn't have a good war by the sounds of the diary, just a young kid, out of his depth and making all the mistakes that you should learn on exercise rather than whilst trying to hold off the might of the German army.
Well, the first problem is - you got the wrong number (or at least the Ayr newspaper did in 1939) He was gazetted 15 December 1939 R.S. Fus. James George MCINTOSH (109052) wheras: K.O.S.B. Peter Allan GRANT (109033) Viewing Page 8309 of Issue 34753
Typical Journalists!! That's fantastic! thank you. and now I have his first two names perhaps I might be able to track down a little more! thank you loads for that. Do you have any information on 162nd OCTU?
& 6 years later - R.S. Fus. War Subs. Lt. J. G. MC!NTOSH (109052) relinquishes his commn. on account of disability, loth Dec, 1945, and is granted the hon. rank of Capt. Viewing Page 6011 of Issue 37381
Do you have any information on 162nd OCTU? The only thing I picked up is that it had something to do with the H.A.C. - which I thought was the Honourable Artillery Company (but I'm really just guessing) Good lord - my guess is probably correct: In the Second World War it (the Honourable Artillery Company) provided four regiments of artillery, while its Infantry Regiment was converted into an Officer Cadet Training Unit, leading to 3,800 commissions. 723 members were killed in the Second World War.
Glad it's been sorted/solved, well sussed as I happen to hate the LG search engine. Maybe though the no. was his cadet number, and so not actually incorrect but not the one given upon commission. My thoughts anyway, as have seen two numbers quoted in gazette for those commissioned from ranks.
While I was ferreting about I came across this - INFANTRY. R. Scots.—Lt. J. G. Macintosh (59222) having attained the age limit of liability to recall ceases to belong to the Res. of Off. 23rd Sept. 1939. I couldn't find anything else on this officer going back to 1914, but I wonder if the simple matter of Mac vs Mc makes a difference otherwise it might have been his Dad.........
Thanks for delving deeper. Not a relation of this McIntosh, I'd found him and looked through, but was told that this fella was a very young 2lt. so an under age limit perhaps, but not old enough Whilst you are there, could you help me find the reg. numbers for: Capt. Butterfield H.W.V. also RSF 1940 Capt. Adamson F.A also RSF 1940 Lt. McDavid I.S. also RSF 1940 Lt. Thomson B.P. also RSF 1940 a little cheeky I know... but every little helps
Bloomin marvellous!!! I wonder if he worked at the depot or something... Going off the lack of promotion between 1939 & 1945 I wonder if he spent the majority of that time as a guest of the Germans? Is there any indication that they managed to evacuate him back to England following his wounding?? If he did make it back home, then I would guess that he spent a large amount of time in hospital / rehabiliation.
He was evacuated, as I have a verbal account from one of the survivors telling that he arrived back in Glasgow in a rather poor state. I presume he was catagorized as not fit for active/ overseas service and kept on till the end of the war. But what you have given me here is marvellous and I am very grateful indeed. thank you DaveB.
Whilst you are there, could you help me find the reg. numbers for: Capt. Butterfield H.W.V. also RSF 1940 Maybe: INFANTRY. R.S. Fus. Lt. H. W. Butterfield (51827), from Supp. Res. .of Off., to be War Subs. Capt. 23rd Dec. 1941. (only entry I could find for that service number / name combo) Viewing Page 2166 of Issue 35562
Whilst you are there, could you help me find the reg. numbers for: Capt. Adamson F.A also RSF 1940 Pre-war regular: R.S. Fus.—Lt. F. A. Adamson to be Capt. 29th Jan. 1939. INFANTRY. The undermentioned Capts to be Majs , 1st July, 1946 R S. Fus. (War Subs Lt.-Col ) D J. A.- STUART (44195). (War Subs Maj ) R. E. PATRICK (53709). (War Subs Maj ) W. P -B ARKWRIGHT, M C. F A. ADAMSON (49793).
Lt. McDavid I.S. also RSF 1940 I wonder if this is him - 19 AUGUST, 1941 R.S. Fus. James Stewart Fraser McDAViD (200218). 4 APRIL, 1946 R.S. Fus. Maj. (temp.) J. S. F. MCDAVID (200218).
thanks. The family tree I am working on is this, so far... The trail to find a photo, has to start with a name and number.. Thanks again DaveB
Lt. Thomson B.P. also RSF 1940 R.S Fus. 15th Dec. 1939: Alan Robert HOUSTOUN (107449). Ian MACKENZIE (111318). Bruce Powell THOMSON (62897), late Lt., Gordons. (and it's good night from me!)
