How long before they're all photographed?

I am relatively new to this site but have an involvement with others in related fields. I have been looking for references here to The War Graves Photographic Project (War Grave and Memorial Photographs supplied by The War Graves Photographic Project) but not come across any so far.
I am sure the site will be of interest to many given some of the postings I have seen here. TWGPP started off under another name and with the intention of photographing the headstone or memorial of every British serviceman or woman killed in action, or dying from injuries received in action since the start of WW1- wherever those headstones or memorials may be.
It has subsequently grown like Topsy and now covers a wider field. There has been cooperation with C.W.G.C. from the very beginning, they kindly supplying information as to 'target' graves. Now there is a formal association with the C.W.G.C.
The TWGPP is composed entirely of volunteers from all over the world and, last time I looked they had over 1.5 million images collected and recorded to date. These are searchable. Donations are sought for electronic or hard copies of images to cover the considerable costs of operating the website etc but collecting and recording is done freely by volunteers. Some far flung members of this (WW2Talk) site may be interested in contributing, details of how to assist are on the TWGPP site. Others may be interested in the contents. Because of past abuse of the information and images, steps have had to be taken to protect copyright but I hope that all will find it a useful, informative and valuable resource even though it's being was intended initially as a resource for the families of the dead and a lasting memorial to them.
The site is not concerned with town and village memorials as such, but centered upon the individuals concerned.
Personally, I think it is a prime example of the internet being put to good use.
Sadly it looks like being an ongoing project for all the wrong reasons. My apologies if I repeat information available elsewhere on this site.
Tim

The only problem I have is that they seem to think that they can pick and choose who they supply images too, something that doesnt fit with the aims of the CWGC in my view.

P

 

I contacted them stating I had a considerable number from France and the ones in Leeds. Whilst they were pleased with my offer they sent me a file telling me how I should take the photographs and it did seem they wanted it taken in a very specific way that ment I'd have to go back and do them all again for them to use them. Anyone who has seen my shots of graves can see the whole headstone and in detail.

I never bothered sending them in-It came across as they were rather picky of how they wanted the stones photographed and having done my first cemetry, a small one in France sometime ago, getting down level with each stone on my knees, I ended up a cripple for the day. Never again will I take them like that.

I think I'll just stick to collecting 1940 RAF, RN, BEF etc Campaign ones for myself.

 

Of course, as soon as I post saying I can't find something, I find it staring me in the face. Apologies.
An opportunity though to comment about the suggested donations at TWGPP and how they arose.
You may be forgiven for thinking that the project is run by a group of well paid people in a fancy hi-tech office. It isn't, it is the internet as its best, a few committed people here and there, backed by many volunteers, showing that for a good common purpose they can produce something that is first class and respected round the world - not for their own sakes but as their personal contribution towards honouring the war dead.
It is rather a victim of its own success; it arose from the shared wish of a few to create a perpetual online memorial and to provide a service for the families of servicemen killed in action. At first, donations were not sought for images, digital or hard copy Though the main aims of the project stayed the same, who might be included changed as it became the leading resource of its kind and others elsewhere failed. It is now a massive undertaking and all the more of an expression of honouring the war dead because it is exclusively performed by volunteers.
The costs, in time and money, of finding out what headstones or memorials meed the criteria to be included, of finding a volunteer to take images to a certain standard and pattern, to checking and editing images, indexing them and getting them on a first class website, are considerable. A more committed bunch of people than those at the core of the project you will never meet. (I couldn't continue to meet the commitment after a few years and am no longer active in the project - but I know what those who are do.)
When I last checked, there were over one and a half million records and images on the website. Without some income from donations it could not be the resource it is, the few people who fund it from their own pockets would need poor relief!
If I remember correctly, donations were invited after a few medal sellers took information and images from the site to increase the value of medals they were selling, never offering anything in return.
I trust it may help to understand the 'donations' issue a little better knowing what the site is for, and what is a 'by product' as it were. At the end of the day, I don't think so many would volunteer to support it if it was in any way commercial, it would devalue their contribution.
Tim
PS. The CWGC have supported the project from its inception, and the TWGPP is now formally associated with it. However, as I understand it their Charter places restrictions on them which prevent them funding the project. Volunteers who spot problems with headstones etc feed the issues back to CWGC through the TWGPP

 

P
I'm not their spokesman but think the answer to your comment lies in the reason for their being, i.e. their original objectives, that they are not part of or governed by the CWGC, and that some 'outsiders' were using them for their own personal profit.

I think the issue with image suitability is much to do with the software that handles the editing - though I am no techie on the subject.

 

If I were looking for single photos of a relative, which I could not find elsewhere for free, then I recommend people to use TWGPP. I have personally used that site to obtain some of the headstones of the fallen of my Dad's Regiment, as part of writing the history of his unit, as I knew that I could not get them elsewhere. It won't be published, so I won't be in breach of their copyright.

If you are doing projects involving large numbers of casualties, then the cost becomes prohibitive anyway. Unless you've got deep pockets of course.

There is no way I'll ever complete a full set of the 32,000 Royal Artillery, so if I and others can post some on WW2Talk and someone finds a free photo, then I'm happy and the Forum benefits from a good reputation as the place to come to for help.

 

Tim, I have sent you a pm on a seperate subject, but I have to agree with Rob. The TWGPP has actually restricted itself to only suppying image to family members who want a single image for personal use, and therefore many of the images will never been seen or used in an act of rememberance.

People will always seek to gain financially from every project raised, but by resricting the copyright they are stiffling acts of rememberence

Image in the CWGC Stopped oepole from reprinting the details from their Db?

P

 

I have been taking pictures as one of the many volunteers for TWPP for quite a few years and it is true that it has grown a lot bigger than it was when first started by serving armed forces personnel. The idea was to help people get a picture of a headstone/grave of a relative or friend that they,in all possiblity, would not be able to visit or obtain. I tend to ignore comments about " another moneymaking scheme or scam" that are directed at the site by people who have no idea about the aims of the project.It just got bigger with all the requests from around the world. You need the facilities to store up to 2 million photos and other bits of information that would be sent with the photo requests for a start, so a home computor was not much good. I, like all TWPP volunteers, have never received any financial rewards at all from doing these pictures , nor do I want any, I just read the thank you notes posted on the site. The copyright of the picture is shared with the person who took the picture and the TWPP,and if when I see requests online if I still have a photo that someone is looking for I send it, or if its local or somewhere I,m going I take the photo and pass it on . Also please remember that the CWGC is a reg. charity, Derek

 

Hello cretophile

Thank you for posting.


You will have noticed that there are a number of individuals on WW2talk collecting photographs for the various service arms for one reason or another and all the forum members chip in to help.If you view some of the threads you will see the far flung assistance given in taking photographs.I would imagine that within the various threads on WW2talk there are a number of thousands of photographs which are there for members to use for their various projects.

I would suggest that most of the photos on WW2talk are well presented.
From my viewpoint any photo I supply is free to whomever wants it and if they state it came from WW2talk it is a bonus for this great site.
So if my photos were up to the standard I would be delighted if they were used by TWGP to enable a family member or a researcher to complete their jigsaw.However I would not want any individual to pay a fee for them.

However I do understand that there are costs involved and perhaps a business plan( I'm sure this has happened) should be drawn up to measure the finances required per annum and maybe apply for a Lottery grant to enable TWGP to give free access to one and all whilst covering all expenses and further enhancing the site.


Dont forget there are many individuals out there with a mass of historical knowledge who could be shackled by lack of funds to carry their projects forward.

 

It just got bigger with all the requests from around the world. You need the facilities to store up to 2 million photos and other bits of information that would be sent with the photo requests for a start, so a home computor was not much good.


So they don't use PC technology, where terrabyte drives are now common?


Also please remember that the CWGC is a reg. charity, Derek
No it is not a registered charity, it operates by Royal Charter

 

As I say to many people who look a bit dumbfounded when I discuss my project, it is a photographic history of recognition of those who gave their lives freely to defeat those that would take away the freedom we enjoy today.

They should never be forgotten.

Cheers

Geoff

 

I suppose when the TWGPP was set up, they did not envisage the sort of projects that our Forum Members would embark upon.

But then again, their own project is quite a formidable one.

 

As a member who takes photos for other people as and when I can all I request is a brief acknowledgement from the member.
If I needed an odd photo yes I would pay but for the amount that are required for members individual projects it would be cost prohibative.

Besides a pleasant afternoon spent in a churchyard is enjoyable especially if its sunny the wildlife and flora is great plus some of the locals you meet and talk to is also part and parcel as is the visit to the church.

PS if you have any tips on photographing stained glass windows let me know

 

if you have any tips on photographing stained glass windows let me know

Photograph them from the inside of the building, so the light coming in shows the beauty of the glass.

 

We will keep going

 

PS if you have any tips on photographing stained glass windows let me know

If you spill some coffee on your camera lens, all your photographs will be of stained glass.......Sorry, I'll get me coat.

 

If you spill some coffee on your camera lens, all your photographs will be of stained glass.......Sorry, I'll get me coat.

 

Photograph them from the inside of the building, so the light coming in shows the beauty of the glass.

These are ones that I took when visiting Guildford Cathedral a couple of months ago. We were on our way to the IoW and stopped for lunch, Derek,

 

I write as a forum member who has a specific interest in gravestones showing a Shield of David (to signify that the deceased was of the Jewish Faith).

Once again, I am glad to place on record how grateful I am to all those members who have unstintingly given much time and effort in identifying and photographing these sites.

Every record posted here (on the AJEX HEADSTONES forum) has been checked against existing Ajex files and in some cases they were completely new to the Ajex database.

Well done everybody !

Ron

 

This is one of the few that I have. This is a memorial stained glass presented by the parents who lost both their sons in ww1 and attended Stoneyhurst College in Lancashire.

Thomas Sydney Ough Dealy was the only ex student ever to be buried at the school's church cemetery.





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