Does anyone know if a bog basic Anti Tank Gun for example a 6 pounder or a PaK38 would be effective against men or thin skinned vehicles?? I take it most of these weopens are designed to fire solid shot, would they have a HE round option? Kev
6-pdr, Data: <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=7 width=916 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width="12%">Calibre (mm/in) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">Shot type (see notes) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="14%">Shell Weight (Kg/lb.) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="15%">Muzzle Velocity (m/sec / ft/sec) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">Max range (m/yards) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">Weight in action (Kg/lb.) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="18%">Penetration </TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width="12%">57/2.24 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">HE AP APCBC APCR APDS </TD><TD vAlign=top width="14%">2.7/6 2.7/6 3.2/7 1.8/4 1.5/3.2 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="15%">823/2700 821/2693 846/2775 1075/3528 1234/4050 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">5030/5500 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">1597/3521 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="18%">- 74mm @ 1000m 88mm @ 1000m 90mm @ 1000m 146mm @ 1000m </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Artillery Equipment page so yes the 6 Pdr had HE rounds. <TABLE height="100%" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=article_title>50mm Pak 38 anti-tank gun model 1938</TD></TR><TR><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD class=article_body><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=190 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=right><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=8 width=180 bgColor=#cccccc border=1><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle> </TD></TR><TR><TD></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=375><TBODY><TR><TD></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=375 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=specifications_title>Specifications</TD></TR><TR><TD></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width=375 border=0><TBODY><TR bgColor=#f2f2f2><TD class=specification_value vAlign=top>Calibre</TD><TD class=specification_value align=right>50mm</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#f8f8f8><TD class=specification_value vAlign=top>Barrel length</TD><TD class=specification_value align=right>3000mm</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#f2f2f2><TD class=specification_value vAlign=top>Vertical field of fire</TD><TD class=specification_value align=right>-8° to +27°</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#f8f8f8><TD class=specification_value vAlign=top>Horizontal field of fire</TD><TD class=specification_value align=right>65°</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#f2f2f2><TD class=specification_value vAlign=top>Weight in action</TD><TD class=specification_value align=right>986kg</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#f8f8f8><TD class=specification_value vAlign=top>Shell weight</TD><TD class=specification_value align=right>HE: 2.250kg AP: 0.975kg</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#f2f2f2><TD class=specification_value vAlign=top>Muzzle velocity</TD><TD class=specification_value align=right>1198m/s</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#f8f8f8><TD class=specification_value vAlign=top>Armour penetration</TD><TD class=specification_value align=right>86mm at 457m</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> WorldWar2.ro - 50mm Pak 38 anti-tank gun model 1938
6-pdr, Data: <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=7 width=916 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width="12%">Calibre (mm/in) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">Shot type (see notes) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="14%">Shell Weight (Kg/lb.) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="15%">Muzzle Velocity (m/sec / ft/sec) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">Max range (m/yards) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">Weight in action (Kg/lb.) </TD><TD vAlign=top width="18%">Penetration </TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width="12%">57/2.24 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">HE AP APCBC APCR APDS </TD><TD vAlign=top width="14%">2.7/6 2.7/6 3.2/7 1.8/4 1.5/3.2 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="15%">823/2700 821/2693 846/2775 1075/3528 1234/4050 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">5030/5500 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="13%">1597/3521 </TD><TD vAlign=top width="18%">- 74mm @ 1000m 88mm @ 1000m 90mm @ 1000m 146mm @ 1000m </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Artillery Equipment page so yes the 6 Pdr had HE rounds. Yep just seenthat chart myself inc the American Ammo which also inc canister. But how effective? How much explosive is actually carried in comparisaon to a simler size howizter. Kev
From the HE shell weights, I'd guess 3-4 grenades' worth of bang at the far end. That should easily be enough for, say, a sandbagged MG nest. A concrete one would depend on whether the fuze gave the round time to penetrate, and one might guess a field gun/AT gun position could need 2 or 3 to mess up weapon and crew beyond reply. Regards, MikB
So the answer is YES. Most basic AT guns would have a HE capability, not surprising really as most earlier smaller weopens would be at the regiment level wouls they? And I guess being man portable to a degree would also be used againsnt infantry. Thanks Guys. Kev
The 2 pounder had no HE shell and i don't think the PaK36 did , I suppose later guns were largely made after the previous non-HE generation had proved the severe deficiency of not being able to fire at least a basic explosive round. Really nice little intelligence assessment of the PaK38 from the ever-interesting lone sentry here: Lone Sentry: 50-mm Antitank Gun, German Pak (WWII U.S. Intelligence Bulletin, February 1943) Correction: 2pdr did have an HE shell, just very rarely issued.
The 2 pounder had no HE shell and i don't think the PaK36 did... Actually the Soviet 45mm was based on the German 37mm (which did have an HE shell), but it was redesigned to the larger calibre to facilitate a larger and more useful HE shell.
