Help with Cassino photo

Discussion in 'Italy' started by Charley Fortnum, Jan 2, 2016.

  1. Stuart Avery

    Stuart Avery In my wagon & not a muleteer.

    Charley, your photo in post 18, I've seen that before. I cant remember which book. Not helping you out at the moment. I may be wrong, Cassino is not in my mind. One of the British Divisions in Italy some-where.

    Stu.
     
  2. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    https://www.instagram.com/damiafix/

    There is a selection of very beautiful shots of Monte Cassino, the Liri Valley and the surrounding countryside here. They're interspersed with other material, but keep scrolling downwards and you'll find plenty more here and there.

    (Clearly this man likes his colour filters!)
     
    4jonboy likes this.
  3. 4jonboy

    4jonboy Daughter of a 56 Recce

    Thanks for posting. Some lovely photos.
    I met Damiano 2 years ago at one of his exhibitions in Cassino Town with the Leger tour. A lovely chap. :)


    Lesley
     
  4. ropey

    ropey Member

    Thank you Charlie. :)
     
  5. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Kurt%20Hielscher%201922%20B.JPG Kurt%20Hielscher%201922%20A.JPG Kurt%20Hielscher%201922%20C.JPG

    I found a few nice photogravure prints of Cassino from 1922.


    Could anybody please tell me whether there are any photographs in existence from inside the Castle/Rocca Janula - either at the time of the battle or before?
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
  6. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    And these two give a good idea of the battlefield -- well the eastern side at least:

    Cassino_Monastery-large.JPG Cassino_Monastery_2-large.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  7. Stuart Avery

    Stuart Avery In my wagon & not a muleteer.

    Charley, the attachment below may be of use to your-self. Its from Fred Majdalany book, CASSINO PORTRAIT OF A BATTLE.
    Will have a look later, to see if i can find anymore.

    Stu. PS. Cracking prints by the way. Thanks..


    CCF01072016 (2).jpg
     
  8. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Thanks I don't have that book (despite it being probably the most famous publication on the battle) and don't recall seeing the 'After' photo, but what I'm really looking for is a photo showing the inside of the castle. I've read a lot about the combat there, but it's hard to picture the scene and nobody much describes the interior beyond naming parts. I saw one modern image, but it looked very modern.

    Edit: I rewatched Monte Cassino: The Soldier's Story the other day and that has aome fleeting shots of the castle interior, but as we know it was hit by tanks and artillery and had pretty much collapsed after the fighting there's nothing that leads me to believe that the reconstruction is authentic. It does show a large courtyard, but little else.
     
  9. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Here's an awful scan of a photograph I'd like to identify/source:

    [​IMG]

    I found it online in an old photo album in a folder labeled 1/4th Essex but with no further detail. Does anybody know where it comes from? I can't find it on the IWM site and I think I have identified all the (named) 1/4th Essex images held by them.

    Moving around that location by daylight at the time that the Essex were in the town was... brave to but it mildly, which makes me doubtful about the attribution.
     
  10. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    James.

    This is just a couple of soldiers wandering around Cassino town after the battle. The photo is probably a posed one.

    Probably a rehearsal for a subsequent motion or still picture.

    Regards

    Frank
     
  11. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    I think you're right, which would probably discount the uploader's suggestion that the men are 4th Essex although a number of men did return to the battlefield later in 1944 to locate and identify dead comrades.

    Just the folder label that made me think it a possibility.
     
  12. ropey

    ropey Member

    it's an IWM shot - NA15009. 3rd Coldstream Guards apparently. See our book, p333,
     
    Charley Fortnum likes this.
  13. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    I haven't reached page 333 yet!

    (Thank you for the identification)

    Given that this is rather your subject, have you an opinion about the existence of contemporary or pre-war photos of the castle interior?
     
  14. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    79953857_1.JPG

    I've no idea how authentic the reconstruction is, but this is the best contemporary shot of the interior that I can find:
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
    4jonboy likes this.
  15. ropey

    ropey Member

    I never managed to find any contemporary interior shots before or after publishing. The reconstruction has a number of non-original features such as the stage in the middle! And what period of the castle's evolution were they aiming at anyway?
     
  16. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    I'm pretty much resigned to the fact that - as you say - the pictures may not exist. Assuming that, given that it's a historical building, I'm on the lookout for a plan of the layout or a sketch.

    Edit:
    http://edu.let.unicas.it/didalab/cassino/storia_i/storia2.htm#rocca1
    http://edu.let.unicas.it/didalab/cassino/storia_i/rocca1.htm
    http://edu.let.unicas.it/didalab/cassino/foto_sto/rocca5.jpg

    Anybody read Italian to identify the source of these images?

    Edit2: Fantastic aerial images from 1944 here:
    http://www.archeologia-aerea.it/downloads/2010CERAUDOSHEPHERDItalianAerial.pdf
     
  17. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Still no photograph, but I found this:

    Screen%20Shot%202017-05-04%20at%2002.20.08.PNG

    This was the layout between the third and fourth battles.

    Found here:
    Ensign in Italy

    Does anybody have a copy of Welsh Guards at War by Ellis, Major L. F. ?

    It supposedly contains a plan of 'The Castle Position at Cassino' - and i'd like to know whether it differs from this one.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  18. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Looking at it now, page 145, exactly the same diagram as you posted.
     
    Charley Fortnum likes this.
  19. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Owen, that's a shame, but I appreciate your looking for me.
     
  20. Mr Jinks

    Mr Jinks Bit of a Cad

    Charley Fortnum likes this.

Share This Page