Hi all I am trying to help a Roberto Lucci from Petritoli in Le Marche, Italy whose great-grandfather sheltered a PoW for some time. The trouble is there is little to go on. Roberto thinks he may have been called David Griffin or Griffiths or Griffith. He was friends with another PoW called Franz, who despite his name was apparently English. Roberto originally contacted a website run by Dennis Hill gives some more detail. The URL for the first post is https://camp59survivors.wordpress.com/2015/12/29/escaped-prisoner-sheltered-in-petritoli/ Here are the two posts: First Post Given the close proximity of his family’s village, Petritoli, to Servigliano, Roberto believes the POW likely escaped from P.G. 59. [ but it could easily have been from PG53 or PG70- AC] Roberto wrote (translated here into English from Italian), “I’m a young man from Petritoli, a village 15km from Servigliano. “I have started to ask some of the elders who have fragmentary recollections of this man [for help]. I know that William and David are the first or last names.” Roberto explained that the man’s last name might have been something similar to David—such as Davidson, Davison, Davis, or Davies. Two escapees found shelter in Petritoli. “[The other was] a certain Franz, who was English, and [so it] was assumed [the man my grandfather took in] was of the same nationality. “The story is basically this: “My great-grandfather, Luigi Lucci, who was blinded during the First World War helped the fugitive because he knew what it meant to be away from home and suffering because of war. “[The escapee he helped] had taken refuge in the countryside near Petritoli along with this British soldier named Franz. “[One of my contacts in the village] told me she was in contact with this Franz, and the last time she saw him was 16 years ago when he came back in Italy with his family. “[My contact] is trying to find the address of Franz, and it seems to her that he was from London.” Of course, it is possible Franz’s comrade was American or from a Commonwealth country, rather than from England. Second Post [SIZE=12.16px]There is a new development in the search for information about the escaped POW who was helped in the comune of Petritoli during the war. (See “[/SIZE]Escaped Prisoner Sheltered in Petritoli[SIZE=12.16px].”)[/SIZE] My earlier post explained that Roberto Lucci is attempting to make contact with the family of an escaped prisoner who was sheltered by his great-grandfather, Luigi Lucci, in 1943–44. Recently, Roberto was told by elders in Petritoli that William and David were part or all of the first or last names, so the soldier’s last name might have been something like David Williams or William Davidson. However, since I published the earlier post, a document has surfaced in Petritoli identifying the escapee as “David Grif. prigioniero inglese” (David Grif. English prisoner). Although the first name was recorded as David, is is conceivable that William was his middle name, or that William was his first name and David his middle name and that he preferred to be called David. [Or, since many adopted a "nom de guerre", his name may not have been David at all - AC] Grif is not a common English name, and the period suggests the name might be abbreviated. The “Alphabetical List” sent to me by Brian Sims, contains 81 soldiers with names beginning with “Grif”—Griffin, Griffith, and Griffiths. There no soldiers in the list named Grif or Griff. Only one of these men is identified as being interned in P.G. 59—I. G. Griffiths. Thirteen have no specific camp identification. Of the 13, two stand out as a potential match for the name David Griffiths or David William Griffiths: Griffiths, D. – Gunner – Army Number 917544 – Royal Artillery – R.O. Number 5 Griffiths, D. W. – Private – Army Number 4978406 – For’ters [Sherwood Foresters (Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire Regiment)] – R.O. Number 20 Liberation of the Province of Ascoli Piceno (including Petritoli) by the Allied troops occurred on June 19, 1944. Therefore, the POW would have been recaptured by the Germans before that time. Anyone with information concerning this POW can write to me at hilld@iu.edu. End of posts Dennis has also sent me the relevant pages of the PoWs in Italy list showing some possible Grif.... details (attached). There seem to be a couple of others who were in PGs 53 or 70 which might also be worth following up. I've also written to this chap http://www.burytimes.co.uk/news/1470326.thank_you_for_saving_my_dads_life/ to see if he might have any leads All a very long shot I know, but your combined expertise has produced fantastic results from very little before!! Anne
917544 - POW details in Germany: Name: D Griffiths Rank: Gunner Army Number: 917544 Regiment: Royal Artillery POW Number: 227567 Camp Type: Stalag Camp Number: IV-A Camp Location: Hohenstein, Hesse Record Office: Royal Artillery (Field) Record Office, Foots Cray, Sidcup, Kent Record Office Number: 5 4978406 - POW details in Germany: Name: D W Griffiths Rank: Private Army Number: 4978406 Regiment: Sherwood Foresters POW Number: 275292 Camp Type: Stalag Camp Number: 357 Camp Location: Oerbke, Lower Saxony Record Office: Infantry and Army Educational Corps Record Office, York Record Office Number: 20 TD
Anne, Douglas William Griffiths born 15/5/1919 died 1Q 2003 Nottingham. He was the only DW Griffiths that appeared in a search of Derbyshire / Nottinghamshire area. He is in the right age range for service in the Foresters during the war. I could be totally wrong, he may be from another part of the country? You may be able to confirm this if he completed a liberation qustionnaire? 917544 GRIFFITHS Daniel joined RA in 1939. He was deemed unfit for further service on the 10/12/1945 Guy
It is possible he completed a Liberation Questionnaire, especially if he ended up in Stalag 357, Fallingbostal, but that assumes he was recaptured. If he remained at large and was repatriated earlier in the war he more than likely will not have completed one and there is no record of an Escape and Evasion report having been completed. I will happily look to see if there is a D Griffiths or D W Griffiths if that will help, next time l am at Kew. Regards, Nick
My understanding is that he was with Roberto's family then just disappeared. There were German patrols active in the area so it is a strong possibility that he was recaptured. Nick your offer to check at Kew is gratefully accepted! Many thanks all so far - my little corner of Italy has a lot to be grateful to this forum for! Anne
Hi All A bit more information from Roberto. The PoW sheltered by his great-grandfather was friends with another - called Franz. Franz used to re-visit the family who looked after him up until about 15 years ago. By quizzing the elderly folk of the village of Petritoli Roberto has learnt that Franz lived in Reading (at least that is what I am assuming from Roberto's spelling of "Redding"), in a house which he had called "Villa Petritoli" So far no surname, but I wondered if anyone had any suggestions as to how we might search for this partial address. I doubt Franz is still with us so w'd be looking for records from, say, the 50s onwards. Many thanks as always Anne
Anne, There is a Franz Schulz (born 1905) registered as living in Reading, Berkshire in 1939. There appear to be several Schulz's still living in the Reading area. Guy
Wow thanks Nick. Although his Italian prison camps were nowhere near Petritoli, he talks of being with the "rebels" in the Adriatic sector of Italy and also mentions Porto San Giorgio which is definitely the right area. I'd say he's worth further exploration. I see he came from Wales ....
Quick update. I've been trying to get more info on the David Lloyd George Griffiths that Nick found (2 above). He gave his address as Gilfach Goch in Glamorgan and i put the details up on a Facebook site for that town. Lots of early interest but no good leads. Are there any of our Welsh brethren or sistren (if that is a word) who can make any other suggestions? Many thanks as always Anne
Hi Anne If this is your man and I can only find 1 x David L G Griffiths Birth details: Name David L G Griffiths Mother's Maiden Surname Walters Date of Registration 1918 - Oct-Nov-Dec[1918] Registration district Merthyr Tydfil Inferred County Glamorganshire Volume Number 11a Page number 1354 Death details: Name David Lloyd G Griffiths Birth Date 8 Nov 1918 Date of Registration Nov 1997 Age at Death 79 Registration district Caerphilly Inferred County Mid Glamorgan Register Number 3 District and Subdistrict 8631 Entry Number 42 Spouse: Kathleen Mary Griffiths (1929-1994) POW details (Germany): Name: D L G Griffiths Rank: Private Army Number: 3909316 Regiment: South Wales Borderers POW Number: 43794 Camp Type: Stalag Camp Number: 317 Camp Location: Sankt Johann im Pongau, Austria Record Office: Infantry Record Office, Exeter Record Office Number: 22 TD
Following some more searching have found his/their marriage details if useful: Name: David L G Griffiths Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1946 Registration district: East Glamorgan Inferred County: Glamorganshire Spouse: Kathleen M Woods Volume Number: 8b Page Number: 758 TD edited to add: There is at least 1 x family tree that holds his details: David Lloyd G Griffiths 1918–1997 BIRTH 8 NOV 1918 • Merthyr Tydfil, Glamorganshire DEATH 3 NOV 1997 • Caerphilly, Mid Glamorgan (for future reference - http://person.ancestry.co.uk/tree/52286550/person/13685222712/facts)
Many thanks horsa - but the one thing we know for sure is that this guy's first name was David. Interesting escape report nonetheless
